I think boot got himself crossthreaded.
McWalla
everyone is midfield effing crazy on here. If he can lock down the best small fwd, then dominate setting up attacks and goals, who the fark cares about playing on the ball. In saying that he will be able to play there to without a problem, but perhaps we will add more value where they are playing him. who knows.And therein lies the problem. He canât. His rebound is great, but he has very little aerial ability, and is a quite mediocre one one one. Which is the reason he is up forward. My guess is his next step will be (tank permitting) wing/mid.
He is up fwd? didnât lock down Ainsworth. Has no areil ability? are we even talking about the same player.
Sorry, I deleted the post. Too many tabs open. Posted in the wrong thread.
Reminds me of the time I was texting back and forward with my wife and following Radio DJR at the same time and accidentally texted âHowâs Conor doing?â to the wife.
Couldâve been a WHOLE lot worse I suppose.
everyone is midfield effing crazy on here. If he can lock down the best small fwd, then dominate setting up attacks and goals, who the fark cares about playing on the ball. In saying that he will be able to play there to without a problem, but perhaps we will add more value where they are playing him. who knows.And therein lies the problem. He canât. His rebound is great, but he has very little aerial ability, and is a quite mediocre one one one. Which is the reason he is up forward. My guess is his next step will be (tank permitting) wing/mid.
He is up fwd? didnât lock down Ainsworth. Has no areil ability? are we even talking about the same player.
Sorry, I deleted the post. Too many tabs open. Posted in the wrong thread.
Reminds me of the time I was texting back and forward with my wife and following Radio DJR at the same time and accidentally texted âHowâs Conor doing?â to the wife.
Couldâve been a WHOLE lot worse I suppose.
What was her reply?
Oh dear
everyone is midfield effing crazy on here. If he can lock down the best small fwd, then dominate setting up attacks and goals, who the fark cares about playing on the ball. In saying that he will be able to play there to without a problem, but perhaps we will add more value where they are playing him. who knows.And therein lies the problem. He canât. His rebound is great, but he has very little aerial ability, and is a quite mediocre one one one. Which is the reason he is up forward. My guess is his next step will be (tank permitting) wing/mid.
He is up fwd? didnât lock down Ainsworth. Has no areil ability? are we even talking about the same player.
Sorry, I deleted the post. Too many tabs open. Posted in the wrong thread.
Reminds me of the time I was texting back and forward with my wife and following Radio DJR at the same time and accidentally texted âHowâs Conor doing?â to the wife.
Couldâve been a WHOLE lot worse I suppose.
What was her reply?
She said he was providing great run off half back but needed to tighten up in the one-on-ones.
Yep, that sounds like Humberta.
everyone is midfield effing crazy on here. If he can lock down the best small fwd, then dominate setting up attacks and goals, who the fark cares about playing on the ball. In saying that he will be able to play there to without a problem, but perhaps we will add more value where they are playing him. who knows.And therein lies the problem. He canât. His rebound is great, but he has very little aerial ability, and is a quite mediocre one one one. Which is the reason he is up forward. My guess is his next step will be (tank permitting) wing/mid.
He is up fwd? didnât lock down Ainsworth. Has no areil ability? are we even talking about the same player.
Sorry, I deleted the post. Too many tabs open. Posted in the wrong thread.
Reminds me of the time I was texting back and forward with my wife and following Radio DJR at the same time and accidentally texted âHowâs Conor doing?â to the wife.
Couldâve been a WHOLE lot worse I suppose.
What was her reply?
She said he was providing great run off half back but needed to tighten up in the one-on-ones.
1 Like
Played in several positions?Yep, and more to the point most of them also played the bulk of their career in different positions to where they began.
Played in several positions?
Find the common thread between these EFC champions: Hird, O'Donnell, Harvey, Madden, T.Daniher, Fletcher, Lucas, Bewick, Wanganeen, J Watson, T Watson, Van Der Haar...They each only appear on your list once?
Technically correct.
Find the common thread between these EFC champions: Hird, O'Donnell, Harvey, Madden, T.Daniher, Fletcher, Lucas, Bewick, Wanganeen, J Watson, T Watson, Van Der Haar...
They each only appear on your list once?
1 Like
Find the common thread between these EFC champions: Hird, OâDonnell, Harvey, Madden, T.Daniher, Fletcher, Lucas, Bewick, Wanganeen, J Watson, T Watson, Van Der HaarâŚ
2010 our first pick Dyson Heppel (mid/HBF) 2011 our first pick Elliot KavanaghRisk pick that could've been anything, 2nd pick Jackson Merrett 2012 we didn't pick a mid till the preseason draft Will Hams 2013 our first pick Zac Merrett HFF who spent some time in the midfield 2014 our first pick Kyle Langford HFF/Utility 2015 our first pick Darcy Parish (MID) 2016 our first pick Andrew McGrath Backpocket/HBFHow does the ball get into the forward line? through the midfield.Our midfields been â â â â â since the early 00s, of course we're midfield fkg crazy. Which flag winning side had a horrible midfield in the last decade?which flag winning side has had a horrible team in the last decade? It took them more then the mids to get them there. Its just the mids get all the recognition.
How do you stop the ball bombarding into our defenders? through the midfield. It is the most important collective position on the field. Win centre clearances and get it forward is the most efficient way to score. Class midfielders are capable of impacting the scoreboard.If you have a â â â â midfield forwards never get a chance. Defenders are over encumbered. and its just â â â â viewing.
Never said the midfield was not important, just that it is no more or less important then other parts of the ground. Most the great players can play anywhere. I think McG will be one of these.
Iâm refuting that its less important. in the modern game the midfield is the most important part of the ground.
Completely agree, essendon drafting forwards and defenders and trying to turn them into mids is one of the reasons weâve seen little success in my opinion. I think you draft mids, if they aren;t good enough, then they go play in an easier position, like half back flank. Of course 90% of the best young kids are thrown into the middle in their junior days, thats why ivâe found our philosophy of drafting flankers to turn them to mids the wrong way around.
Eagles were the perfect example of how a great midfield can make the rest of the â â â â around it look good. Hopefully woosha brings that to essendon.
Our first pick was a back pocket/HBF, 2nd was a utility, 3rd was a forward, 4th midfield, 5th midfielder
but weâre using our low picks on midfielders, which usually means the players have glaring flaws that need to be worked on (clarke disposal/ mutch speed) Most of the time these weaknesses canât be improved.
Now I think McG will be a good player at the worst case. Ridley looks promising, but its targeting a need 4 years from now. Fridge has just exploded into cult status in a pre-season game and theres talk of him becoming a midfielder? are we really gonna be the club that takes a promising 3rd tall who kicked 4 goals in his first real hit out to the midfield?. Mutch looks like quite the player (except this make 1 side elite bullshit), and clarke could just be an absolute bull. But weâve been able to do brutes in the past, we need those that can win the odd contested ball as well as then drill it 40metres to a target.
Parish is the most midfieldiest player weâve ever drafted which is a start. But most of our other midfielders didnât start in the midfield and its showing when the overall quality of our midfield will be found lacking. (Yes zach and heppell are exceptions more than the rule, both being hff/hbf respectively)
Essendon has had 2 glaring weaknesses for the last decade, midfield and small forwards. weâve addressed the small forwards but weâre still have some bizarre notions about midfield drafting that is utterly bizarre.
Iâll probably drop the subject in this thread for now, just wanted to get up on my soapbox.
2010 our first pick Dyson Heppel (mid/HBF)
2011 our first pick Elliot KavanaghRisk pick that couldâve been anything, 2nd pick Jackson Merrett
2012 we didnât pick a mid till the preseason draft Will Hams
2013 our first pick Zac Merrett HFF who spent some time in the midfield
2014 our first pick Kyle Langford HFF/Utility
2015 our first pick Darcy Parish (MID)
2016 our first pick Andrew McGrath Backpocket/HBFWe have invested heavily in mids over the last 7 drafts. I also think itâs also very important to be a flexible player considering the amount of guys you need to play through their you need a few strings to your bow. Heppel, Merrett, Langford have all shown they can play in different positions, McGrath can obviously play behind the ball but Iâm sure we have drafted him to play on it.
IDC what shaw says private school footy isnât the closest thing to afl that juniors can play.
Sorry, but that just ignores reality at U18 level. Which is that players play multiple positions. Heppell, Zerrett, McGrath, Myers, Begley were clearly midfield options when drafted. The fact Kav had some risks is besides the point. And it is likely the club saw both Laverde and Langford (and Redman, a 2015 2nd round pick) all pushing through the midfield like an Ablett/SJ/Chapman/Mercuri/Long did. Hell, Dodoro on draft night was already saying Ridley and Begley were picked as midfielders. And in JLT2 Ridley across the middle.We havenât been taking flankers and turning them into midfielders. Weâve been drafting strong midfield prospects. The fact many of them didnât play exclusively midfield at U18 level is unimportant. Next Iâll hear Logue, Pears, Rance werenât/arenât good defensive prospects since all the best KP players at U18 level play forwardâŚ
Youâve constructed an argument that is impossible to disagree with. Whatâs the difference between âclearlyâ a midfielder who didnât predominantly play there, and a player from another position who youâre trying to turn into a midfielder? In the latter case the evidence is âthatâs where he spent most of his time playingâ in the former itâs âwell obviously we wouldnât use pick 1/6/8 on just a half back flanker, so heâs obviously not just a half back flankerâ.
Edit: I feel like we should take this discussion somewhere besides the McGrath thread.
I think the point is, that basically every player thatâs drafted is capable of playing in multiple positions, whether they have much direct experience in multiple roles or not. In fact if they werenât flexible they would find it very hard to get drafted in most cases.
Itâs the coaches who then look at their attributes once drafted and send them down a path of developing into a specific kind of player at AFL level. Much of this direction is as influenced as much by the needs of the team as it is by the individuals attributes and skillset.
Either way, this idea that Essendon is alone in drafting players who may develop into something other than what their junior role was, completely ignores the drafting of all other clubs and the long history of V/AFL players, including many bonafide champions of the game, who have developed their game over time in different positions. Itâs a Blitz myth perpetuated by idiots who read far too much into what the recruiters say on draft day, who live in a bubble unaffected by anything that happens at other clubs and who ignore anything that contradicts their established position.
Fkg spot on. Especially about the bubble factor and the perpetuated myth that only Essendon seem to âprojectâ players with a future vision that may be shock horror different to where they played as a 17 year old.
I resemble that remark.
2010 our first pick Dyson Heppel (mid/HBF) 2011 our first pick Elliot KavanaghRisk pick that could've been anything, 2nd pick Jackson Merrett 2012 we didn't pick a mid till the preseason draft Will Hams 2013 our first pick Zac Merrett HFF who spent some time in the midfield 2014 our first pick Kyle Langford HFF/Utility 2015 our first pick Darcy Parish (MID) 2016 our first pick Andrew McGrath Backpocket/HBFHow does the ball get into the forward line? through the midfield.Our midfields been â â â â â since the early 00s, of course we're midfield fkg crazy. Which flag winning side had a horrible midfield in the last decade?which flag winning side has had a horrible team in the last decade? It took them more then the mids to get them there. Its just the mids get all the recognition.
How do you stop the ball bombarding into our defenders? through the midfield. It is the most important collective position on the field. Win centre clearances and get it forward is the most efficient way to score. Class midfielders are capable of impacting the scoreboard.If you have a â â â â midfield forwards never get a chance. Defenders are over encumbered. and its just â â â â viewing.
Never said the midfield was not important, just that it is no more or less important then other parts of the ground. Most the great players can play anywhere. I think McG will be one of these.
Iâm refuting that its less important. in the modern game the midfield is the most important part of the ground.
Completely agree, essendon drafting forwards and defenders and trying to turn them into mids is one of the reasons weâve seen little success in my opinion. I think you draft mids, if they aren;t good enough, then they go play in an easier position, like half back flank. Of course 90% of the best young kids are thrown into the middle in their junior days, thats why ivâe found our philosophy of drafting flankers to turn them to mids the wrong way around.
Eagles were the perfect example of how a great midfield can make the rest of the â â â â around it look good. Hopefully woosha brings that to essendon.
Our first pick was a back pocket/HBF, 2nd was a utility, 3rd was a forward, 4th midfield, 5th midfielder
but weâre using our low picks on midfielders, which usually means the players have glaring flaws that need to be worked on (clarke disposal/ mutch speed) Most of the time these weaknesses canât be improved.
Now I think McG will be a good player at the worst case. Ridley looks promising, but its targeting a need 4 years from now. Fridge has just exploded into cult status in a pre-season game and theres talk of him becoming a midfielder? are we really gonna be the club that takes a promising 3rd tall who kicked 4 goals in his first real hit out to the midfield?. Mutch looks like quite the player (except this make 1 side elite bullshit), and clarke could just be an absolute bull. But weâve been able to do brutes in the past, we need those that can win the odd contested ball as well as then drill it 40metres to a target.
Parish is the most midfieldiest player weâve ever drafted which is a start. But most of our other midfielders didnât start in the midfield and its showing when the overall quality of our midfield will be found lacking. (Yes zach and heppell are exceptions more than the rule, both being hff/hbf respectively)
Essendon has had 2 glaring weaknesses for the last decade, midfield and small forwards. weâve addressed the small forwards but weâre still have some bizarre notions about midfield drafting that is utterly bizarre.
Iâll probably drop the subject in this thread for now, just wanted to get up on my soapbox.
2010 our first pick Dyson Heppel (mid/HBF)
2011 our first pick Elliot KavanaghRisk pick that couldâve been anything, 2nd pick Jackson Merrett
2012 we didnât pick a mid till the preseason draft Will Hams
2013 our first pick Zac Merrett HFF who spent some time in the midfield
2014 our first pick Kyle Langford HFF/Utility
2015 our first pick Darcy Parish (MID)
2016 our first pick Andrew McGrath Backpocket/HBFWe have invested heavily in mids over the last 7 drafts. I also think itâs also very important to be a flexible player considering the amount of guys you need to play through their you need a few strings to your bow. Heppel, Merrett, Langford have all shown they can play in different positions, McGrath can obviously play behind the ball but Iâm sure we have drafted him to play on it.
IDC what shaw says private school footy isnât the closest thing to afl that juniors can play.
Sorry, but that just ignores reality at U18 level. Which is that players play multiple positions. Heppell, Zerrett, McGrath, Myers, Begley were clearly midfield options when drafted. The fact Kav had some risks is besides the point. And it is likely the club saw both Laverde and Langford (and Redman, a 2015 2nd round pick) all pushing through the midfield like an Ablett/SJ/Chapman/Mercuri/Long did. Hell, Dodoro on draft night was already saying Ridley and Begley were picked as midfielders. And in JLT2 Ridley across the middle.We havenât been taking flankers and turning them into midfielders. Weâve been drafting strong midfield prospects. The fact many of them didnât play exclusively midfield at U18 level is unimportant. Next Iâll hear Logue, Pears, Rance werenât/arenât good defensive prospects since all the best KP players at U18 level play forwardâŚ
Youâve constructed an argument that is impossible to disagree with. Whatâs the difference between âclearlyâ a midfielder who didnât predominantly play there, and a player from another position who youâre trying to turn into a midfielder? In the latter case the evidence is âthatâs where he spent most of his time playingâ in the former itâs âwell obviously we wouldnât use pick 1/6/8 on just a half back flanker, so heâs obviously not just a half back flankerâ.
Edit: I feel like we should take this discussion somewhere besides the McGrath thread.
I think the point is, that basically every player thatâs drafted is capable of playing in multiple positions, whether they have much direct experience in multiple roles or not. In fact if they werenât flexible they would find it very hard to get drafted in most cases.
Itâs the coaches who then look at their attributes once drafted and send them down a path of developing into a specific kind of player at AFL level. Much of this direction is as influenced as much by the needs of the team as it is by the individuals attributes and skillset.
Either way, this idea that Essendon is alone in drafting players who may develop into something other than what their junior role was, completely ignores the drafting of all other clubs and the long history of V/AFL players, including many bonafide champions of the game, who have developed their game over time in different positions. Itâs a Blitz myth perpetuated by idiots who read far too much into what the recruiters say on draft day, who live in a bubble unaffected by anything that happens at other clubs and who ignore anything that contradicts their established position.
2010 our first pick Dyson Heppel (mid/HBF) 2011 our first pick Elliot KavanaghRisk pick that could've been anything, 2nd pick Jackson Merrett 2012 we didn't pick a mid till the preseason draft Will Hams 2013 our first pick Zac Merrett HFF who spent some time in the midfield 2014 our first pick Kyle Langford HFF/Utility 2015 our first pick Darcy Parish (MID) 2016 our first pick Andrew McGrath Backpocket/HBFHow does the ball get into the forward line? through the midfield.Our midfields been â â â â â since the early 00s, of course we're midfield fkg crazy. Which flag winning side had a horrible midfield in the last decade?which flag winning side has had a horrible team in the last decade? It took them more then the mids to get them there. Its just the mids get all the recognition.
How do you stop the ball bombarding into our defenders? through the midfield. It is the most important collective position on the field. Win centre clearances and get it forward is the most efficient way to score. Class midfielders are capable of impacting the scoreboard.If you have a â â â â midfield forwards never get a chance. Defenders are over encumbered. and its just â â â â viewing.
Never said the midfield was not important, just that it is no more or less important then other parts of the ground. Most the great players can play anywhere. I think McG will be one of these.
Iâm refuting that its less important. in the modern game the midfield is the most important part of the ground.
Completely agree, essendon drafting forwards and defenders and trying to turn them into mids is one of the reasons weâve seen little success in my opinion. I think you draft mids, if they aren;t good enough, then they go play in an easier position, like half back flank. Of course 90% of the best young kids are thrown into the middle in their junior days, thats why ivâe found our philosophy of drafting flankers to turn them to mids the wrong way around.
Eagles were the perfect example of how a great midfield can make the rest of the â â â â around it look good. Hopefully woosha brings that to essendon.
Our first pick was a back pocket/HBF, 2nd was a utility, 3rd was a forward, 4th midfield, 5th midfielder
but weâre using our low picks on midfielders, which usually means the players have glaring flaws that need to be worked on (clarke disposal/ mutch speed) Most of the time these weaknesses canât be improved.
Now I think McG will be a good player at the worst case. Ridley looks promising, but its targeting a need 4 years from now. Fridge has just exploded into cult status in a pre-season game and theres talk of him becoming a midfielder? are we really gonna be the club that takes a promising 3rd tall who kicked 4 goals in his first real hit out to the midfield?. Mutch looks like quite the player (except this make 1 side elite bullshit), and clarke could just be an absolute bull. But weâve been able to do brutes in the past, we need those that can win the odd contested ball as well as then drill it 40metres to a target.
Parish is the most midfieldiest player weâve ever drafted which is a start. But most of our other midfielders didnât start in the midfield and its showing when the overall quality of our midfield will be found lacking. (Yes zach and heppell are exceptions more than the rule, both being hff/hbf respectively)
Essendon has had 2 glaring weaknesses for the last decade, midfield and small forwards. weâve addressed the small forwards but weâre still have some bizarre notions about midfield drafting that is utterly bizarre.
Iâll probably drop the subject in this thread for now, just wanted to get up on my soapbox.
2010 our first pick Dyson Heppel (mid/HBF)
2011 our first pick Elliot KavanaghRisk pick that couldâve been anything, 2nd pick Jackson Merrett
2012 we didnât pick a mid till the preseason draft Will Hams
2013 our first pick Zac Merrett HFF who spent some time in the midfield
2014 our first pick Kyle Langford HFF/Utility
2015 our first pick Darcy Parish (MID)
2016 our first pick Andrew McGrath Backpocket/HBFWe have invested heavily in mids over the last 7 drafts. I also think itâs also very important to be a flexible player considering the amount of guys you need to play through their you need a few strings to your bow. Heppel, Merrett, Langford have all shown they can play in different positions, McGrath can obviously play behind the ball but Iâm sure we have drafted him to play on it.
IDC what shaw says private school footy isnât the closest thing to afl that juniors can play.
Sorry, but that just ignores reality at U18 level. Which is that players play multiple positions. Heppell, Zerrett, McGrath, Myers, Begley were clearly midfield options when drafted. The fact Kav had some risks is besides the point. And it is likely the club saw both Laverde and Langford (and Redman, a 2015 2nd round pick) all pushing through the midfield like an Ablett/SJ/Chapman/Mercuri/Long did. Hell, Dodoro on draft night was already saying Ridley and Begley were picked as midfielders. And in JLT2 Ridley across the middle.We havenât been taking flankers and turning them into midfielders. Weâve been drafting strong midfield prospects. The fact many of them didnât play exclusively midfield at U18 level is unimportant. Next Iâll hear Logue, Pears, Rance werenât/arenât good defensive prospects since all the best KP players at U18 level play forwardâŚ
Youâve constructed an argument that is impossible to disagree with. Whatâs the difference between âclearlyâ a midfielder who didnât predominantly play there, and a player from another position who youâre trying to turn into a midfielder? In the latter case the evidence is âthatâs where he spent most of his time playingâ in the former itâs âwell obviously we wouldnât use pick 1/6/8 on just a half back flanker, so heâs obviously not just a half back flankerâ.
Edit: I feel like we should take this discussion somewhere besides the McGrath thread.
I think we should be experimenting with our starting mids in the next JLT focussed around what we use to take advantage of McGraths pace and cleans hands. I'd like to see the following combos.Heppell, McGrath, Tippa
Watson, Hocking, McGrath
Langford, Parsih, McGrath
He can go back to the pocket in the second half. But I think we need to have a look at him as a mid.
I disagree, but only because I think our actual main midfielders need the ground time together.
We have plenty of talent, but our systems are still not there. So forget about work loads as much as possible. Forget about hiding tactics from opposition. Just get out there with a full strength side and play as if it was round 1 for the first 3 QTRs. If that is working well, then you can muck around trying stuff in the last for kicks and giggles.
I think we should be experimenting with our starting mids in the next JLT focussed around what we use to take advantage of McGraths pace and cleans hands. Iâd like to see the following combos.
Heppell, McGrath, Tippa
Watson, Hocking, McGrath
Langford, Parsih, McGrath
He can go back to the pocket in the second half. But I think we need to have a look at him as a mid.
1 Like
It is not just meant to be any player. Its meant to be players that either:
- Did play midfield at U18, but not exclusively. E.g. Begley played midfield for his later games only as his engine improved, even if his initial games were all as a forward. Ridley played forward, midfield and back at U18 and U17 level.
- The club states very early on that the expectation is that player X can play position Y.
The second case is literally what people were talking about. The club states very early on, normally the draft night interview, that they expect (insert flanker name) can play midfield.
2 Likes
If he has anywhere near the career of wnganeen ( in defence) that will make me blissfully happy!!
2 Likes