The relevant comparison would be, say, Langford taking ruck contests because Draper couldn’t get to them, or because we’d set up with Draper a kick behind the play.
Hobbs will never be that guy…
2 Likes
Hobbs was a far better performer without Parish in the team. As was Caldwell.
4 Likes
Not many 200cm players running 2kms in 6 minute flat and 20 meters in under 3 seconds back then.
I dont think the comparisons are helpful. Different era’s with different players, different tactics and different resources.
6 foot 2 or 3 midfielders are common now where as in era’s past that was a very tall ruckman. Running requirements are completely different. The goals that Daicos used to kick were miraculous where now some are stock standard.
Langford slightly taller than john Nicholls, Don McKenzie and Sam Newman, to name a few.
2 Likes
Along with being taller he would be a massive upgrade on agility, running capacity and strength.
He may be more agile and could run further than Big Nick, but would not match strength. And in the case of Don McKenzie would never match meanness.
Still, it’s unhelpful to compare players from era’s over 50 years apart. Players now are professional. The game is their bread and butter. And they are well rewarded for it.
Players in bygone era’s had jobs to go to. Teams trained at night so all players and coaches could be there. Even todays VFL players have jobs and train in the evening.
Agree with this. Someone recently said something on here that really resonated with me, drawing comparisons to Richmond breaking the “Ninthmond” tag, by utilising their best mids outside of the midfield and allowing their younger talent to wet their beaks a bit more.
I thought the Hobbs/Caldwell combo last year looked promising (even Setterfield when fit). Zerrett is dynamic, he can wear a tag and find a way to be damaging in other positions (e.g. up forward against Fark Carlton), but Parish I fear isn’t as flexible.
Brad’s got some work to do.
3 Likes
For sure.
The discussion was about whether Hobbs looked like a traditional ruck-rover. And then what that actually meant, and how translatable that term even was.
In my mind, the traditional terms translate to modern football as follows
Ruck = ruck
Centreman = The in and under mid who distributes to those outside the contest.
Rover = the guy who will pick up the crumbs as the ball comes off the pack, or off the contest, and then break away. Not the first possession type
Ruck - rover = the taller type who will be an aerial threat, who would more likely be the player to get on the end of the bail out kick. In centre square setups this player would more likely have a defensive side role.
Of course these aren’t overly meaningful, and often players will be a hybrid of 2 or more types, but for me it works as a way of keeping the traditional terms without resorting to garbage terms made up by BT, and serves a purpose to explain the type of player you’re talking about.
1 Like
Bidzy tried to tell you all.
1 Like
My man Hobbs love him and what he brings
Kid is going to break out soon i can feel it
2 Likes
Nonsense. Times have changed, but the dedication that champions showed to the game was there when I started watching the Bomber teams from 1962 onwards.
The discussion was not about training at all, it started when @Captain_Jack mentioned ruck-rover. Now Captain Jack; Jack Clark if you do not know who he was, was super professional, trained the house down and was as fit as any athlete of the time. His brother who set world running records remarked the Jack was fitter than him.
Todays players are bigger, stronger, fitter, but skills are not greatly improved, football ability has perhaps diminished, and while the players back then, did have jobs, they had much less distractions as well.
I think it was Perce who first mentioned Ruck Rover. That position was later changed to followers, which also covered rucks and rovers. Jack Clarke took up running in the off season to maintain his fitness and held several world aged records at different stages. The running during the off season was not a new thing as Bill Hutchison was renowned for doing it to increase his endurance.
2 Likes
The "term “follower” was always used as a collective enclosing ruck, ruck-rover and rover, because they followed the ball around the ground. Basically, in simplistic language, the ruckman brought the ball to ground but if the possession wasn’t clean it was up to the ruck-rover to get in and under and get the ball out to the rover.
The centreman played in the centre, not all around the ground, sometimes outside the pack at centre bounces, sometimes in and under, sometimes negating his opposite number. These duties at centre bounces were shared with the ruck-rover, whose position was a hybrid one, as reflected in the name of the position.
Yes, the game has changed, but if you watch old video of Hugh Mitchell in the 1960s, you will see him performing a similar function to that of Ben Hobbs today.
Always remember that one of the greatest changes of the last 30 years took place when the Snydey Swans managed to introduce rugby mauls into the game in general play even in good weather, not just on days when it was pishing rain. This has seen the ruck-rover turned into just one more inside midfielder.
1 Like
I agree mate and the only thing I can see holding him back is lack of midfield minutes, and no doubt thats exactly what’s going to happen.
1 Like
I’ve sorted Hobbs’s games in 2023 by contested possession count and highlighted the four games that Parish missed.
Feels like this perspective is more ‘it’s the vibe, it’s mabo’ than reality?
5 Likes
He was just about my favorite player at the time and I tried my hardest to do drop-kicks just like him.
I laughed my head off when he was not rated in the best 25 players to don the sash. Good as they were to put Mark Harvey and Mark Thompson ahead of Hugh Mitchell was just worng.
2 Likes
I like this post. We should re-claim the names of the Centre men.
Ruck rover - BBM
Centre - defensive midfielder
Rover - small quick/ attacking midfielder
I always attribute that degradation of the game to the Hawks of 1970. As a result of their rolling mauls the league brought in the centre square.
Skills are not greatly improved… lol spare me
1 Like