Makes me sick reading about this guys history and all the outstanding warrants that he had on him. This was preventable.
Victorian Government needs to get rid of the bail justice system asap. Anyone can basically be a bail justice and there is little to no training at all to become one.
Not exactly true Trip ess.
However, that is why it is called a “Justice” system. Police should not have the power for unfettered detainment of suspects, and they need to present their case, they obviously did not here.
More legitimately, we should be questioning a system where some-one can be in jail on bail for 18 months and then either found not guilty at court or police drop charges due to lack of evidence or they find the real villain.
Reality is that this nut-job had not committed any serious offenses until he stabbed his bro on Friday. Probably impossible to protect our society from lone madmen who want to kill and maim, without all of us giving up massive freedoms.
Easy after the event to be wise, but it doesn’t bring those killed back to life.
I would have thought these rated as serious offences:
Driving down the wrong side of St Kilda Rd whilst involved in a police pursuit.
Multiple charges of driving whilst disqualified
Multiple charges of theft.
Multiple charges of dangerous driving
Theft of an EFTPOS machine
Failure to appear at court
Given the above, its blatantly obvious that the concept of bail means nothing to him. He was always going to jump in a car again.
Either the bail justice was not told about these pending charges - and the question then is why not.
Or he/she was told and made a terrible judgement call.
Makes me sick reading about this guys history and all the outstanding warrants that he had on him. This was preventable.
Victorian Government needs to get rid of the bail justice system asap. Anyone can basically be a bail justice and there is little to no training at all to become one.
As a former cop, it isn’t just bail justices. Magistrates can be just as bad.
Actually none of those offences are particularly serious in the overall scheme of things.
Police opposed bail. It’s not their fault.
It’s also not the Bail Justice’s fault, they are simply working within the confines of a broken system where capacity is at breaking point.
Look. If the community has come to a view that we want all potentially violent offenders remanded in all circumstances then that’s fine (and a legitimate view to hold). However if we as a community come to that decision, then we literally need to build 4-5 more prisons.
Well good, “build them” you say? Ok fine. However either your taxes will go up quite a bit to pay for it, or the government will have to borrow significantly to fund it. Either of which the public/opposition/media will complain about incessantly.
And there’s also the matter of where to put these four prisons. Do you want one in your suburb? Yeah, didn’t think so.
This is why the system is broken and will likely remain broken.
Actually none of those offences are particularly serious in the overall scheme of things.
Police opposed bail. It’s not their fault.
It’s also not the Bail Justice’s fault, they are simply working within the confines of a broken system where capacity is at breaking point.
Look. If the community has come to a view that we want all potentially violent offenders remanded in all circumstances then that’s fine (and a legitimate view to hold). However if we as a community come to that decision, then we literally need to build 4-5 more prisons.
Well good, “build them” you say? Ok fine. However either your taxes will go up quite a bit to pay for it, or the government will have to borrow significantly to fund it. Either of which the public/opposition/media will complain about incessantly.
And there’s also the matter of where to put these four prisons. Do you want one in your suburb? Yeah, didn’t think so.
This is why the system is broken and will likely remain broken.
Are you f**king kidding me?
Driving down the wrong side of St Kilda Rd whilst in a police pursuit is not a serious offence?
Actually none of those offences are particularly serious in the overall scheme of things.
Police opposed bail. It’s not their fault.
It’s also not the Bail Justice’s fault, they are simply working within the confines of a broken system where capacity is at breaking point.
Look. If the community has come to a view that we want all potentially violent offenders remanded in all circumstances then that’s fine (and a legitimate view to hold). However if we as a community come to that decision, then we literally need to build 4-5 more prisons.
Well good, “build them” you say? Ok fine. However either your taxes will go up quite a bit to pay for it, or the government will have to borrow significantly to fund it. Either of which the public/opposition/media will complain about incessantly.
And there’s also the matter of where to put these four prisons. Do you want one in your suburb? Yeah, didn’t think so.
This is why the system is broken and will likely remain broken.
Are you f**king kidding me?
Driving down the wrong side of St Kilda Rd whilst in a police pursuit is not a serious offence?
No
These bail justices deal with violent offenders every day. They are the ones who get remanded. There’s very little room left in the system for the others.
So yeah, it’s serious in your black and white assessment, but comparatively, not so much.
You want to put him in jail, fine. Who do you let out? The guy who just beat his wife? The armed robber? The drug dealer? The murderer?
Actually none of those offences are particularly serious in the overall scheme of things.
Police opposed bail. It’s not their fault.
It’s also not the Bail Justice’s fault, they are simply working within the confines of a broken system where capacity is at breaking point.
Look. If the community has come to a view that we want all potentially violent offenders remanded in all circumstances then that’s fine (and a legitimate view to hold). However if we as a community come to that decision, then we literally need to build 4-5 more prisons.
Well good, “build them” you say? Ok fine. However either your taxes will go up quite a bit to pay for it, or the government will have to borrow significantly to fund it. Either of which the public/opposition/media will complain about incessantly.
And there’s also the matter of where to put these four prisons. Do you want one in your suburb? Yeah, didn’t think so.
This is why the system is broken and will likely remain broken.
Are you f**king kidding me?
Driving down the wrong side of St Kilda Rd whilst in a police pursuit is not a serious offence?
No
These bail justices deal with violent offenders every day. They are the ones who get remanded. There’s very little room left in the system for the others.
So yeah, it’s serious in your black and white assessment, but comparatively, not so much.
You want to put him in jail, fine. Who do you let out? The guy who just beat his wife? The armed robber? The drug dealer? The murderer?
If you don’t think driving down the wrong side of one the main roads in the city of Melbourne is not a serious offence, then I can’t help you. That is absolute political correctness/stupidity at its worst.
As for jails - there is always room for these types of offenders. The fact they were able to move the juvenile offenders in a pinch would lay evidence to that I would have thought.
Actually none of those offences are particularly serious in the overall scheme of things.
Police opposed bail. It’s not their fault.
It’s also not the Bail Justice’s fault, they are simply working within the confines of a broken system where capacity is at breaking point.
Look. If the community has come to a view that we want all potentially violent offenders remanded in all circumstances then that’s fine (and a legitimate view to hold). However if we as a community come to that decision, then we literally need to build 4-5 more prisons.
Well good, “build them” you say? Ok fine. However either your taxes will go up quite a bit to pay for it, or the government will have to borrow significantly to fund it. Either of which the public/opposition/media will complain about incessantly.
And there’s also the matter of where to put these four prisons. Do you want one in your suburb? Yeah, didn’t think so.
This is why the system is broken and will likely remain broken.
Are you f**king kidding me?
Driving down the wrong side of St Kilda Rd whilst in a police pursuit is not a serious offence?
No
These bail justices deal with violent offenders every day. They are the ones who get remanded. There’s very little room left in the system for the others.
So yeah, it’s serious in your black and white assessment, but comparatively, not so much.
You want to put him in jail, fine. Who do you let out? The guy who just beat his wife? The armed robber? The drug dealer? The murderer?
If you don’t think driving down the wrong side of one the main roads in the city of Melbourne is not a serious offence, then I can’t help you. That is absolute political correctness/stupidity at its worst.
As for jails - there is always room for these types of offenders. The fact they were able to move the juvenile offenders in a pinch would lay evidence to that I would have thought.
By the way, a new hail is being built.
On a scale of pinched a bag of lollies from the supermarket to committing a terrorist act and blowing up a building where you rate driving on the wrong side of the road?
Actually none of those offences are particularly serious in the overall scheme of things.
Police opposed bail. It’s not their fault.
It’s also not the Bail Justice’s fault, they are simply working within the confines of a broken system where capacity is at breaking point.
Look. If the community has come to a view that we want all potentially violent offenders remanded in all circumstances then that’s fine (and a legitimate view to hold). However if we as a community come to that decision, then we literally need to build 4-5 more prisons.
Well good, “build them” you say? Ok fine. However either your taxes will go up quite a bit to pay for it, or the government will have to borrow significantly to fund it. Either of which the public/opposition/media will complain about incessantly.
And there’s also the matter of where to put these four prisons. Do you want one in your suburb? Yeah, didn’t think so.
This is why the system is broken and will likely remain broken.
Are you f**king kidding me?
Driving down the wrong side of St Kilda Rd whilst in a police pursuit is not a serious offence?
No
These bail justices deal with violent offenders every day. They are the ones who get remanded. There’s very little room left in the system for the others.
So yeah, it’s serious in your black and white assessment, but comparatively, not so much.
You want to put him in jail, fine. Who do you let out? The guy who just beat his wife? The armed robber? The drug dealer? The murderer?
If you don’t think driving down the wrong side of one the main roads in the city of Melbourne is not a serious offence, then I can’t help you. That is absolute political correctness/stupidity at its worst.
As for jails - there is always room for these types of offenders. The fact they were able to move the juvenile offenders in a pinch would lay evidence to that I would have thought.
By the way, a new hail is being built.
On a scale of pinched a bag of lollies from the supermarket to committing a terrorist act and blowing up a building where you rate driving on the wrong side of the road?
I would have thought its an 8/10 in terms of seriousness on your scale above.
He drove down the wrong side of a very busy city whilst in a police pursuit. This wasn’t a parking ticket. I’m not quite sure why people are trying to dismiss it as trivial.
Actually none of those offences are particularly serious in the overall scheme of things.
Police opposed bail. It’s not their fault.
It’s also not the Bail Justice’s fault, they are simply working within the confines of a broken system where capacity is at breaking point.
Look. If the community has come to a view that we want all potentially violent offenders remanded in all circumstances then that’s fine (and a legitimate view to hold). However if we as a community come to that decision, then we literally need to build 4-5 more prisons.
Well good, “build them” you say? Ok fine. However either your taxes will go up quite a bit to pay for it, or the government will have to borrow significantly to fund it. Either of which the public/opposition/media will complain about incessantly.
And there’s also the matter of where to put these four prisons. Do you want one in your suburb? Yeah, didn’t think so.
This is why the system is broken and will likely remain broken.
Are you f**king kidding me?
Driving down the wrong side of St Kilda Rd whilst in a police pursuit is not a serious offence?
No
These bail justices deal with violent offenders every day. They are the ones who get remanded. There’s very little room left in the system for the others.
So yeah, it’s serious in your black and white assessment, but comparatively, not so much.
You want to put him in jail, fine. Who do you let out? The guy who just beat his wife? The armed robber? The drug dealer? The murderer?
If you don’t think driving down the wrong side of one the main roads in the city of Melbourne is not a serious offence, then I can’t help you. That is absolute political correctness/stupidity at its worst.
As for jails - there is always room for these types of offenders. The fact they were able to move the juvenile offenders in a pinch would lay evidence to that I would have thought.
By the way, a new hail is being built.
On a scale of pinched a bag of lollies from the supermarket to committing a terrorist act and blowing up a building where you rate driving on the wrong side of the road?
I would have thought its an 8/10 in terms of seriousness on your scale above.
He drove down the wrong side of a very busy city whilst in a police pursuit. This wasn’t a parking ticket. I’m not quite sure why people are trying to dismiss it as trivial.
no one is dismissing it as trivial, that is your assumption of what they are saying and it is wrong.
They are saying that when a bail justice or magistrate sees two offenders and one is physical assault and one is driving down the wrong side of the road, then the judgment will be to lock up the assault and grant bail to the driving offense. Right or wrong, that is what will happen most times.
^ he also seems to view driving on the wrong side of the road (in isolation) as being far more sinister than it actually is
Actually none of those offences are particularly serious in the overall scheme of things.
Police opposed bail. It’s not their fault.
It’s also not the Bail Justice’s fault, they are simply working within the confines of a broken system where capacity is at breaking point.
Look. If the community has come to a view that we want all potentially violent offenders remanded in all circumstances then that’s fine (and a legitimate view to hold). However if we as a community come to that decision, then we literally need to build 4-5 more prisons.
Well good, “build them” you say? Ok fine. However either your taxes will go up quite a bit to pay for it, or the government will have to borrow significantly to fund it. Either of which the public/opposition/media will complain about incessantly.
And there’s also the matter of where to put these four prisons. Do you want one in your suburb? Yeah, didn’t think so.
This is why the system is broken and will likely remain broken.
Are you f**king kidding me?
Driving down the wrong side of St Kilda Rd whilst in a police pursuit is not a serious offence?
No
These bail justices deal with violent offenders every day. They are the ones who get remanded. There’s very little room left in the system for the others.
So yeah, it’s serious in your black and white assessment, but comparatively, not so much.
You want to put him in jail, fine. Who do you let out? The guy who just beat his wife? The armed robber? The drug dealer? The murderer?
If you don’t think driving down the wrong side of one the main roads in the city of Melbourne is not a serious offence, then I can’t help you. That is absolute political correctness/stupidity at its worst.
As for jails - there is always room for these types of offenders. The fact they were able to move the juvenile offenders in a pinch would lay evidence to that I would have thought.
By the way, a new hail is being built.
On a scale of pinched a bag of lollies from the supermarket to committing a terrorist act and blowing up a building where you rate driving on the wrong side of the road?
I would have thought its an 8/10 in terms of seriousness on your scale above.
He drove down the wrong side of a very busy city whilst in a police pursuit. This wasn’t a parking ticket. I’m not quite sure why people are trying to dismiss it as trivial.
Surely you jest?
8/10 would put driving on the wrong side of the road on par with attempted murder or plotting to commit a terrorist act
Are people in this thread really criticising the police? Seriously?
Love how some people are armchair experts on how police should have reacted in an incredibly fast moving situation to prevent something that has literally never happened in this city before and that nobody could reasonably have predicated beforehand.
I dunno. I haven’t, like, instantly dismissed suggestions that police should shoot anyone doing donuts…
Actually none of those offences are particularly serious in the overall scheme of things.
Police opposed bail. It’s not their fault.
It’s also not the Bail Justice’s fault, they are simply working within the confines of a broken system where capacity is at breaking point.
Look. If the community has come to a view that we want all potentially violent offenders remanded in all circumstances then that’s fine (and a legitimate view to hold). However if we as a community come to that decision, then we literally need to build 4-5 more prisons.
Well good, “build them” you say? Ok fine. However either your taxes will go up quite a bit to pay for it, or the government will have to borrow significantly to fund it. Either of which the public/opposition/media will complain about incessantly.
And there’s also the matter of where to put these four prisons. Do you want one in your suburb? Yeah, didn’t think so.
This is why the system is broken and will likely remain broken.
Are you f**king kidding me?
Driving down the wrong side of St Kilda Rd whilst in a police pursuit is not a serious offence?
No
These bail justices deal with violent offenders every day. They are the ones who get remanded. There’s very little room left in the system for the others.
So yeah, it’s serious in your black and white assessment, but comparatively, not so much.
You want to put him in jail, fine. Who do you let out? The guy who just beat his wife? The armed robber? The drug dealer? The murderer?
If you don’t think driving down the wrong side of one the main roads in the city of Melbourne is not a serious offence, then I can’t help you. That is absolute political correctness/stupidity at its worst.
As for jails - there is always room for these types of offenders. The fact they were able to move the juvenile offenders in a pinch would lay evidence to that I would have thought.
By the way, a new hail is being built.
On a scale of pinched a bag of lollies from the supermarket to committing a terrorist act and blowing up a building where you rate driving on the wrong side of the road?
Given how trigger-happy this state is on dishing out and enforcing fines for doing 54km/h in a 50 zone, you would think a much more dangerous act of driving would be treated with at least some minor severity.
Actually none of those offences are particularly serious in the overall scheme of things.
Police opposed bail. It’s not their fault.
It’s also not the Bail Justice’s fault, they are simply working within the confines of a broken system where capacity is at breaking point.
Look. If the community has come to a view that we want all potentially violent offenders remanded in all circumstances then that’s fine (and a legitimate view to hold). However if we as a community come to that decision, then we literally need to build 4-5 more prisons.
Well good, “build them” you say? Ok fine. However either your taxes will go up quite a bit to pay for it, or the government will have to borrow significantly to fund it. Either of which the public/opposition/media will complain about incessantly.
And there’s also the matter of where to put these four prisons. Do you want one in your suburb? Yeah, didn’t think so.
This is why the system is broken and will likely remain broken.
Are you f**king kidding me?
Driving down the wrong side of St Kilda Rd whilst in a police pursuit is not a serious offence?
No
These bail justices deal with violent offenders every day. They are the ones who get remanded. There’s very little room left in the system for the others.
So yeah, it’s serious in your black and white assessment, but comparatively, not so much.
You want to put him in jail, fine. Who do you let out? The guy who just beat his wife? The armed robber? The drug dealer? The murderer?
If you don’t think driving down the wrong side of one the main roads in the city of Melbourne is not a serious offence, then I can’t help you. That is absolute political correctness/stupidity at its worst.
As for jails - there is always room for these types of offenders. The fact they were able to move the juvenile offenders in a pinch would lay evidence to that I would have thought.
By the way, a new hail is being built.
Political correctness?
What the hell did SMJ write, that had slightest thing to do with political correctness.
Actually none of those offences are particularly serious in the overall scheme of things.
Police opposed bail. It’s not their fault.
It’s also not the Bail Justice’s fault, they are simply working within the confines of a broken system where capacity is at breaking point.
Look. If the community has come to a view that we want all potentially violent offenders remanded in all circumstances then that’s fine (and a legitimate view to hold). However if we as a community come to that decision, then we literally need to build 4-5 more prisons.
Well good, “build them” you say? Ok fine. However either your taxes will go up quite a bit to pay for it, or the government will have to borrow significantly to fund it. Either of which the public/opposition/media will complain about incessantly.
And there’s also the matter of where to put these four prisons. Do you want one in your suburb? Yeah, didn’t think so.
This is why the system is broken and will likely remain broken.
Are you f**king kidding me?
Driving down the wrong side of St Kilda Rd whilst in a police pursuit is not a serious offence?
No
These bail justices deal with violent offenders every day. They are the ones who get remanded. There’s very little room left in the system for the others.
So yeah, it’s serious in your black and white assessment, but comparatively, not so much.
You want to put him in jail, fine. Who do you let out? The guy who just beat his wife? The armed robber? The drug dealer? The murderer?
If you don’t think driving down the wrong side of one the main roads in the city of Melbourne is not a serious offence, then I can’t help you. That is absolute political correctness/stupidity at its worst.
As for jails - there is always room for these types of offenders. The fact they were able to move the juvenile offenders in a pinch would lay evidence to that I would have thought.
By the way, a new hail is being built.
Political correctness?
What the hell did SMJ write, that had slightest thing to do with political correctness.
Seeking non-traditional pathways through a vibrant cosmopolitan community while challenging old world authoritarianism.
Actually none of those offences are particularly serious in the overall scheme of things.
Police opposed bail. It’s not their fault.
It’s also not the Bail Justice’s fault, they are simply working within the confines of a broken system where capacity is at breaking point.
Look. If the community has come to a view that we want all potentially violent offenders remanded in all circumstances then that’s fine (and a legitimate view to hold). However if we as a community come to that decision, then we literally need to build 4-5 more prisons.
Well good, “build them” you say? Ok fine. However either your taxes will go up quite a bit to pay for it, or the government will have to borrow significantly to fund it. Either of which the public/opposition/media will complain about incessantly.
And there’s also the matter of where to put these four prisons. Do you want one in your suburb? Yeah, didn’t think so.
This is why the system is broken and will likely remain broken.
Are you f**king kidding me?
Driving down the wrong side of St Kilda Rd whilst in a police pursuit is not a serious offence?
No
These bail justices deal with violent offenders every day. They are the ones who get remanded. There’s very little room left in the system for the others.
So yeah, it’s serious in your black and white assessment, but comparatively, not so much.
You want to put him in jail, fine. Who do you let out? The guy who just beat his wife? The armed robber? The drug dealer? The murderer?
If you don’t think driving down the wrong side of one the main roads in the city of Melbourne is not a serious offence, then I can’t help you. That is absolute political correctness/stupidity at its worst.
As for jails - there is always room for these types of offenders. The fact they were able to move the juvenile offenders in a pinch would lay evidence to that I would have thought.
By the way, a new hail is being built.
Political correctness?
What the hell did SMJ write, that had slightest thing to do with political correctness.
Actually none of those offences are particularly serious in the overall scheme of things.
Police opposed bail. It’s not their fault.
It’s also not the Bail Justice’s fault, they are simply working within the confines of a broken system where capacity is at breaking point.
Look. If the community has come to a view that we want all potentially violent offenders remanded in all circumstances then that’s fine (and a legitimate view to hold). However if we as a community come to that decision, then we literally need to build 4-5 more prisons.
Well good, “build them” you say? Ok fine. However either your taxes will go up quite a bit to pay for it, or the government will have to borrow significantly to fund it. Either of which the public/opposition/media will complain about incessantly.
And there’s also the matter of where to put these four prisons. Do you want one in your suburb? Yeah, didn’t think so.
This is why the system is broken and will likely remain broken.
Are you f**king kidding me?
Driving down the wrong side of St Kilda Rd whilst in a police pursuit is not a serious offence?
No
These bail justices deal with violent offenders every day. They are the ones who get remanded. There’s very little room left in the system for the others.
So yeah, it’s serious in your black and white assessment, but comparatively, not so much.
You want to put him in jail, fine. Who do you let out? The guy who just beat his wife? The armed robber? The drug dealer? The murderer?
If you don’t think driving down the wrong side of one the main roads in the city of Melbourne is not a serious offence, then I can’t help you. That is absolute political correctness/stupidity at its worst.
As for jails - there is always room for these types of offenders. The fact they were able to move the juvenile offenders in a pinch would lay evidence to that I would have thought.
By the way, a new hail is being built.
Political correctness?
What the hell did SMJ write, that had slightest thing to do with political correctness.
Seeking non-traditional pathways through a vibrant cosmopolitan community while challenging old world authoritarianism.