Rugby Union


#723

No. I Folau has forfeited his seat on the unity train.


#724

Born-agains are often the worst.


#725

We agree on the end result, so I’ll just leave it at that.


#726

Take it to the Politics thread, ScoMo-hater.


#727

Freedom of speech doesn’t exist in this country. And if it did it wouldn’t apply to Rugby Australia or the NFL.

He also forgot to mention the 9th sin in that little passage, the sin of Hatred.


#728

When I worked in banking my 2IC was a devout Muslim. 2 years earlier he was taking everything and drinking/f***ing his way round Melbourne. Refound God, got married, made his wife (a doctor) cover up and went full mus.


#729

That’s the good thing about these redemption religions. You can go sick on every vice and as long as you repent in time you’ll be sweet. The Catholics have an even better system where you can break every rule they’ve got but confess and they wipe the slate clean. You can do this every week if you want.


#730

It’s not hate speech because his masters teach (and he seems to believe) that delivering the sinner to the christian god is their only chance at salvation. He probably thinks he is acting to save them. The christian story is powerful and Folau, who doesn’t seem capable of independent thought, is just another over zealous devotee.


#731

or the leader of that anti ■■■ christian sect in america turning out to be gay.

it tends to be the ones wanting to hide something that are the loudest about sin.


#732

Why is Folau being called out for his tweet re homosexuals, but those of us that appear on the same list multiple times have accepted his right to repeat in public what are crucial (idiotic but crucial) moral teachings of his church?
The Bible says some mean stuff about homosexuality so tackle the source of the problem. I think the government needs to pass legislation targeting mainstream religions for peddling this krap, and leave individuals alone.


#733

Folau signed an employment contract whereby he agreed not to broadcast certain views he has that are contray to the interests of his employer. He didn’t sign a contract to not hold these views, just that he wouldn’t broadcast said views to the public.

Qantas is the main Rugby Australia sponsor. to the tune of 4 mil a year. It is well known that the CEO of Qantas is gay. Having endured one twitter rant from Folau, do you think they were going to let another go without either pulling the sponsorship or imposing some form of massive penalty for it. As such his employer was bound to take action. Losing 4 million a year isn’t a trivial amount.

Where would they get this money back? Alcohol? Nope he had a swipe at drunks too (and what Aussie alcohol would need the international exposure given they mostly cater to a domestic market?).

Plenty of employment contracts restrict the ability of their employees to express themselves freely (think the clothes you wear to work, the fact that you don’t tell your clients what you really think of them, drop the c-bomb in meetings etc) and the Industrial Tribunal has held employers have prerogative to set these standards as part of the employment contract (within reason).

I expect if this matter is contested, it will result in a small payment to end the saga. But I don’t expect Folau to win big, because 1) we don’t have freedom of expression codified anywhere and 2) The potential impact that his post would have had on his employer if they did not take action.

Finally I believe Garry Ablet Jr and other AFL players liked the post. It will be interesting to see what if any action is taken against them.


#734

I don’t support employment contracts that are contrary to the universal declaration of human rights. Nothing will be done against other christians who liked the post, as we are a bunch of hypocrites. If a sponsor withdraws their support because one member of the rugby community openly expresses a mainstream religious teaching, exercising a value (freedom of speech) that differentiates our society from brutal authoritarian regimes that crush the opposition or alternate voice, then we can live without their manipulative support.
We have allowed these institutions to occupy a privileged and powerful position in our society, where they are influential throughout government, business and social organisations. Then we go postal on a dumb footballer who doesn’t realise they peddle in lies and deceit.


#735

As we know from recent AFL contracts common law rights can be waived by specific waivers in contracts.
It may not be so clear if a contract contains clauses that are against legislated law, and I believe contracts that contain clauses that are against legislated laws are not enforceable.

In any case, allegedly the recent contract he signed did not include the clauses which enable RA to sack him for “hate speech” however that is defined. When they tried to insert the clauses, he allegedly refused to sign them.
However, there may be other clauses “game into disrepute” which they can get him on.

There will be a code of conduct hearing and its going to get very legal.

So, its not going to be so easy for Qantas to get their way and have him sacked. Of course they could put in some extra money so that RA can afford to hire decent lawyers.


#736

1/3 of the Wallaby side ( and arguably the hard core of the team ) is Polynesian, and they hold very strong religious beliefs. Maybe those religious beliefs are even stronger than the desire to make money.

Qantas and the ARU potentially have a revolt brewing among the players, in the lead up to the World Cup. Basically they are stuffed in this campaign anyway, but may as well pull out if they have to replace 6-8 of their top players.

Worse, the ARU is on its knees as a code locally and this whole disaster could be the coup de gras. Joyce is not amused and might pull Qantas sponsorship irrespective of the Code of Conduct hearing result.


#737

It has to be a concern. Still think the best outcome is that they find a way to keep Folau playing.


#738

Folau.
We finally found a $1M a year player with the integrity to tell his employers to stick whats left of their $4M back in the bank, he is not changing his religious views.

I don’t believe in the god construct of Christians+Islamists+Jews and a lot of their outdated scriptures. I am firm in my belief there is no god. I am not LGBTIQ, but if others are/want to be they can go for it.

However, I admire Folau. He says what he believes and does not resile from it.


#739

If QANTAS want to throw their millions at a high profile Australian Sporting team with minimal success in the past 15 years then I think they should consider Essendon.

We have good brand crossover too, we are the Bombers from Essendon/Tullamarine and they fly planes from both Essendon and Tullamarine.


#740

He was never, ever asked to change his religious views.

He was asked, and agreed to, not publish his threats against certain sections of the market his employer operates within.

He failed to do so. Breach of contract.


#741

How Joyce hasn’t pulled up stumps now is beyond me.

Even if they do sack him Australian rugby is Comedy Central.

And if anyone could offer any theory’s as to why we played off in a wc final 10 years ago and now this I’m all ears. Did private school fees go up or something


#742

So is it really a threat to post that gay people (amongst others) will be doomed to a non-existent fantasy land of fire and brimstone.

Reckon all the publicity this dumb post (from my anti-religious perspective) has driven will cause much more grief than the post itself.

Folau is a great sportsman and it is pity that we have become so politically correct. It was really a post that you go blah, and move on.