Training Monday 8/2/16

imo the worst outcome would be to win "more games than people think" only to finish 10-14 ish then get reamed by Fitpatricks c****s and their almost certain priority pick ie Carlton getting picks 1 & 2 in a likely good draft while we finish better than expected solely on the back of 1 year stand ins who'll never play again - just to keep up the AFL's TV ratings.

Pick 1 and a priority pick - if F*** Carltank get one we must too - should be the bare minimum we’d be hoping for. … we wont be getting any other compensation for whats been done over 4 years now.

No matter what happens we won’t be getting a priority pick.
But it would be funny if Carlton beat us twice and ended up with 5 or so wins and it’s those two wins that cost them a priority pick.

Our best chance of getting a second high pick is if Hooker leaves as a restricted free agent.

Thanks again Jackie and Karma. Great report as usual.

I will be happy with pick 2.
Carlton can get the spoon and apply heaps of pressure to number 1 pick, comparing to our gun number 2 pick.

That's pleasing that now we have secured Grimley that Brown can move back.

Grimley as an experienced dangerous big man will go someway to replacing Hooker’s presence up forward and easing the pressure on JD by taking the main defender.

Also Brown back with and Hartley as our two main kpd, Ambrose as our reserve kpd backup and then Gwilt or Francis as our 3rd tall defender is a setup that should be able to cope.

Here’s hoping we get some midfield cohesion to ensure that backline isn’t constantly under the pump however.

Sorry just don’t see this. If he was actually dangerous or experienced, surely a club like freo or farkcarlton who are crying out for talls would have drafted him.

As long he puts in a good stint, 100% effort every time he pulls on the jumper I’ll be happy.

25yrs old. Been in the system of current best AFL club since drafted so that would class as experienced in my book.

Leading VFL goal kicker last 2yrs with 45 and 46 goals hence the dangerous comment. Couldn’t get past the Hawks main kpf’s.

Why he wasn’t picked up by those other clubs I can only guess. Perhaps Carlton having Casboult, continued blind faith in Jones and push for youth (cleaned up with kpp in draft, including taking Curnow and McKay). And perhaps Freo having similar players to him in their system already like Hannath, Apeness.

Of course he clearly isn’t a superstar, I didn’t suggest otherwise but just remember Smack was on the scrapheap too.

Agree about the 100% effort and we’ll all be happy. And expect this will the case as he hopes to re-ignite an AFL career with many years still ahead of him if he can.

No pick 1 thanks. No finishing last. Pick 2 is fine (and I’m preparing for it)

imo the worst outcome would be to win "more games than people think" only to finish 10-14 ish then get reamed by Fitpatricks c****s and their almost certain priority pick ie Carlton getting picks 1 & 2 in a likely good draft while we finish better than expected solely on the back of 1 year stand ins who'll never play again - just to keep up the AFL's TV ratings.

Pick 1 and a priority pick - if F*** Carltank get one we must too - should be the bare minimum we’d be hoping for. … we wont be getting any other compensation for whats been done over 4 years now.

I seem to remember other clubs getting knocked back priority pick requests due to reasons of mismanagement. (strangely i think most requests for a priority pick would stem from mismanagement except maybe an act of God!). I would have thought we fall into this basket rightly or wrongly. Imagine the other clubs reeling if we took pick 1 and and an end of 1st round priority, not to mention Jaegar bomb coming on board as a free agent. Happy days but not on the cards.

First session I’d seen under the Woosha regime on a fairly overcast morning at Tulla and there was certainly a strange atmosphere compared to what I had experienced every other time in the past.

Thinking of how hyped we and everyone around the club would be at this time of year normally with more and more match practice coming into training really rams the point home as to how completely farked this situation is, as it was exceptionally hard to muster any excitement about what this team will be able to manage based on today.

Not to say we will be winless and nothing will be gained, but we are certainly pushing up ■■■■ creek as far as wins and losses go (as we all know) and excitement is most likely only going to come from individual performers and not our look as a football side (again, as expected.)

As Jackie said the main drill was a fairly soft match simulation primarily focused on ball movement, with the boundary lines brought in by about 10 minutes down the length of the ground presumably to improve ball movement in more confined spaces.

As a collective, the skills were completely shizen and our movement going forward is absolutely horrendous. Nothing new. Without knowing what sort of load they’re in and what coaches are asking a lot of the players seemed very relaxed when personally I would think greater intensity would be just what the doctor ordered. Anyway, this drill went on for what seemed like two hours with some slight variation before the group split into their lines and fiddled around with simple things with nothing of note before groups split into running and boxing.

Positives are important though and don’t get me wrong there definitely are some.

Orazio has pace and will need to use it. Will be one of our most important players this year if he can get it to click as probably the key line breaker.

Zakka looks as good as I’ve ever seen him, looked like he was really trying to set the tone on the track and probably got the three votes on the day. Trademark receive at 60, run to 50 and straight through the middle at the Airport End at one point brought a smile.

The Langford is looking exceptionally fit and really strong. Ran Longy and Irish off their legs in the running drill the three of them were doing and is going to be a very very good player. Side note but was interested in one of the intervals of this drill when Irish and Longy had hands on hips and Langers had his hands on his head Justin Crow piped up with “Get your hands down off your head, our body language has to be strong.”

Kommer is fit and going well, sight of him working one on one with fitness staff late on by making two or three leads to an imaginary kicker whilst screaming for the ball before doubling back to goal to crumb the footy thrown by the coach was quite funny when he would abuse the imaginary kicker for not honouring his lead. Good character for the group.

Of the others, Hartley will get some bags kicked on him if he’s thrown in to the deep end but is a solid footballer and a good pick up. Luey is running laps which is something, Joey will have a tough year unless he pulls out plenty of individual brilliance, Yestin had a bit of it, Gach spent an hour on the bike, Francis and Redman did a few drills on the Etihad oval along with some laps and I didn’t notice Laverde, Gleeson or Edwards but my eyes are farked so they might have hidden up the far end.

Of the top ups spent a lot of time watching Kelly and Grimley who will both be serviceable. Kelly spent a minute or two talking to 5 or 6 of the young mids after a drill at one point which was good to see, the experience of a three time premiership player will be invaluable. Crowley looks so happy to be here and appreciated the effort of me and a mate for coming down to watch. Not sure if Stokes was out there.

Could ramble on so will answer any questions as best I can but to summarise I think Jackies mention of the ‘holding pattern’ situation we are in is ultimately the best way to describe it at the minute. I did find myself thinking half way through that if the skills and movement clicked, we could be fairly competitive… and even if they don’t we’ll still beat Carlton twice.

Sounds like they all need to head to the local pub, drink 20 pots each, get in a few fights, play some pool and get to know each other. Hey, it use to work in the 70’s.

I will be happy with pick 2. Carlton can get the spoon and apply heaps of pressure to number 1 pick, comparing to our gun number 2 pick.

If Carlton win 2 or 3 they’ll be a red hot chance for a priority pick. That would give us pick 3.
If we win 1 or 2 and finish below Carlton with 3 wins, it’ll be very hard to give them a priority without giving us one too - regardless that it might be due to our ‘poor management’.

Sorry to be off topic. Great summary - again!

One official suggested to me that we are in "a holding pattern" until everything bursts out and comes together. Everyone's trying their best and this description is a good way of looking at our current position so we leave Tullamarine now while the players kick back with nachos and hot dogs to watch the Super Bowl.

I can elaborate further on this, I had a mate that was their today also, who I spoke to whilst the boys were training, but of reference, he is a development coach for the Dandenong Stingrays and was having a sticky beak at Gach to see how he is coming along. He told me we were better than he expected we where going to be, and looked like a bunch of guys who where still in that consolidation phase of not only a new game plan but getting to know each others tendencies as team mates, but told me that out of the 30 odd that were part of the match sim work it could be easy to see 18 that had a good handle on what was going on and to keep in mind that the sides were quite mixed as far as experience level and game plan understanding was concerned.

He said a lot of players were still in that phase where second nature has not kicked in yet as far as game plan goes, still thinking about it a lotl, the result was they missed spots and such, but said skill errors were mostly the result of pressure than form. He seemed to think we were further along than what would be reasonably expected. This gave me a lot of confidence, because he is a Hawks man and the type that if we were utter tripe he would have been sending me messages telling me how ■■■■ we were.

I think that most of us assumed, optimistically, that the top up players would all slot in and immediately start playing like old teammates, when in fact they’ve never played together before, many of them are from the VFL rather than the AFL, and together with the draftees they make up almost half our list. So it’s not surprising, now that it’s actually happening, that the reality is not up to our optimistic expectations at this stage.

That doesn’t mean that they can’t or won’t do what the official suggested and suddenly all click together, but it’s not definite that that will happen at all, or when it will happen if it does. The situation seems to cry out for leaders, and we really need the players who are continuing from last year, plus the coaches, and plus also some of the top ups, to step forward and provide that leadership. Even those whose natural preference is to go quietly about their work and leave others to take the lead.

I think our optimism was probably based on the assumption that most of the top ups were pretty fit, and that although most of them were either at the end of their playing days or hadn’t been able to cement a spot in a top team, they were still nevertheless at least good, experienced, serviceable players. That assumption in itself seems fair enough. So there’s still a sound basis for hoping that before the season has gone too far, the players will begin to play as well as they can, and as a real team. And when that happens, we really should start to win some games.

Should we tank? Never. It’s never a good idea. Carlton tried it and Melbourne tried it and they got the consequent draft picks. But they were on the bottom when they tried it and they remained on the bottom. Tanking ruins the culture. It would be the worst possible thing for us to do. Our culture has taken a beating as it is, and the last thing we want to so is trash it some more by not caring about winning games.

I will be happy with pick 2. Carlton can get the spoon and apply heaps of pressure to number 1 pick, comparing to our gun number 2 pick.

If Carlton win 2 or 3 they’ll be a red hot chance for a priority pick. That would give us pick 3.
If we win 1 or 2 and finish below Carlton with 3 wins, it’ll be very hard to give them a priority without giving us one too - regardless that it might be due to our ‘poor management’.

Sorry to be off topic. Great summary - again!

my point exactly.

I will be happy with pick 2. Carlton can get the spoon and apply heaps of pressure to number 1 pick, comparing to our gun number 2 pick.

If Carlton win 2 or 3 they’ll be a red hot chance for a priority pick. That would give us pick 3.
If we win 1 or 2 and finish below Carlton with 3 wins, it’ll be very hard to give them a priority without giving us one too - regardless that it might be due to our ‘poor management’.

Sorry to be off topic. Great summary - again!

We will have 12 priority picks coming into 2017. They can shove the rest up their collective arses.

As a collective, the skills were completely shizen and our movement going forward is absolutely horrendous.

Don’t sugarcoat it. What do you really think?

I will be happy with pick 2. Carlton can get the spoon and apply heaps of pressure to number 1 pick, comparing to our gun number 2 pick.

Gibbs asked to say hi to Gumby.

We’re fkd

One official suggested to me that we are in "a holding pattern" until everything bursts out and comes together. Everyone's trying their best and this description is a good way of looking at our current position so we leave Tullamarine now while the players kick back with nachos and hot dogs to watch the Super Bowl.

I can elaborate further on this, I had a mate that was their today also, who I spoke to whilst the boys were training, but of reference, he is a development coach for the Dandenong Stingrays and was having a sticky beak at Gach to see how he is coming along. He told me we were better than he expected we where going to be, and looked like a bunch of guys who where still in that consolidation phase of not only a new game plan but getting to know each others tendencies as team mates, but told me that out of the 30 odd that were part of the match sim work it could be easy to see 18 that had a good handle on what was going on and to keep in mind that the sides were quite mixed as far as experience level and game plan understanding was concerned.

He said a lot of players were still in that phase where second nature has not kicked in yet as far as game plan goes, still thinking about it a lotl, the result was they missed spots and such, but said skill errors were mostly the result of pressure than form. He seemed to think we were further along than what would be reasonably expected. This gave me a lot of confidence, because he is a Hawks man and the type that if we were utter tripe he would have been sending me messages telling me how ■■■■ we were.

maybe hes evolved and going for that next level wind up.

am i right in thinking that last year we kicked in to training probables vs possibles much earlier than we have this year (if indeed we did that last year at all)?

in terms of getting players to ‘gel’ one would think constantly switching up sides and a stream of different VFL players and top ups combined with structural uncertainty that revolves around the top ups and key tall posts would be contributing to the lack of ‘gelling’ significantly.

we’ll get a much better idea of where we are as they start to stabilize a nominal best 22 and start to give them time on the track together.

regardless the apparent problems with ball movement make me all the more convinced that we should use BJ behind the ball this year to direct traffic and to set an example with with his aggressive ball use. if we want to encourage the youngsters to be brave with the ball in hand somebody needs to be out there leading by example. I could well say the same for using Kelly off half back though i don’t think has the same kicking penetration as BJ.

However you look at it, with jobe, myers, hocking and hepp out we can expect a lot of our play to be starting at half back (though this in itself underscores the importance of brown and hartley breaking even) and consequently piling as much kicking ability and experience into the backline as we can makes sense.

this shouldn’t be treated as a gap year and i think it is important to be as competitive as possible. I’d be looking to set the side up with kickers in the backline and encourage the likes of langford, parish, raz, zaha, laverde to works their guts out providing options on the spread.

i also like the idea of using Mckernan as a blicavs style follower, he may not have the running ability of blicavs but he is a more natural and talented footballer.

next couple of months will be interesting as woosh starts to tip his hand a bit.

thanks as always for the reports.

anyone who thinks we will get a priority pick now or ever is deluded. Carlton wont either. The best possible outcome for this club is to win as many games as possible, and at the same time ensure that the team is as competitive as possible in every match. It is the only way to fast track development of the young guys. Going through the motions for the sake of it, and coming last is not what we should ever be about as a club.

Anyone who says people are deluded if they don’t think the same thing as they do is deluded.

Am I doing it right?