VFL - Round 4 vs Pies @ Windy Hill, 2pm Saturday 27 April 2019

They’ve been quite clear that will now count as a quick, which is why there was preseason analysis on who was doing those kicks at AFL level.

I know, just don’t think it should be.

Is it really any different to someone get a possession for a free kick from a ball going OOBF? If they kick it from the square it still doesn’t count. I think its as reasonable interpretation as we were going to get. I find it hard to argue when McKenna runs out to 25m and kicks it that that isn’t a kick.

It’s not whether it’s reasonable, it’s whether it’s comparable. But, for example, we kinda lost that battle when footy became so negative anyway; if you’re a defender and not getting 30 disposals nowadays you suck*.

*Ambrose excepted

You can realistically add a minimum 5 possessions onto any defender who kicks out compared to every game played before this year in the sport’s history (and most importantly compared to all their other teammates in any given game), sometimes 10, sometimes even more. 28 possessions makes people look at a player a hell of a lot differently than 18 does, no matter how much we like to say we don’t care about stats, it’s ingrained. They need to change it. At least make the play on a minimum of 10 meters or something before a stat is counted (I realise that’s convoluted, but there has to be a minimum) - the majority of these kick ins the person kicking it is just wandering a couple of meters out of the square, and with the additional rule of the player on the mark being moved further back it means there’s zero risk with playing on and getting a free stat.

As to the out on the full comparison @Ants brought up, the day one player is on the receiving end of 10 out on the full free kicks in the same game come talk to me lol. This interpretation is falsely manipulating statistics in a way that’s unprecedented since statistics became a really big part of the game in the last 20-30 years or so, and some players are going to directly benefit while it will cost others.


The likes of GAJ and Ben Cousins have been falsifying stats for ages with their one-twos.


But its also quite clear that the impact of the guy kicking out is substantially greater than last year, so should their stats not reflect that?

And frankly, outside of around the water fountain, does it matter? Those in the know understand how stats are used. You shouldn’t compare the disposal efficiency of an inside guy versus a back flanker for example. Or the metres gained stats of an inside and outside guy. This is just one more thing to be aware of.

I remember a discussion I had with HAP last year. I said that Langford should be aiming to get to around 22-24 possessions a game average. He pooh-poohed me saying that was the same as Hirdy got in his Brownlow year. Which he was correct on. But in that year, that made Hirdy like the 3rd highest average disposal getter in the league. In 2017, it put you outside the top 100 players (by average disposals).

Stats matter, but they’ve always had to be careful comparing across eras, and time periods. This is just one more change.

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I remember when I lost my dreamteam premiership because Cornes and another player deep in the last quarter just kept kicking it to each other to use up time. I was screaming at the other team to man up! Lost by a handful of points. :frowning:


You mustn’t be talking about AFL commentators then

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I reckon the kick out is an important responsibility to be given and should always have been a counted stat. It’s far more valuable to the team than say a 2m handpass to a flat footed teammate.


Wells looks faaaat.

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Isn’t the kickout technically a free kick awarded after the opposing team misses a goal?

Joel Selwood has been padding his stats with ill-deserved free kicks for years.


Your ideas are intriguing to me, and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter.

Except, again, this is a distortion not just across eras, but across teammates in the same game. I’m not worried about how possessions compare now to 1996, I’m worried about how they compare across teammates in the same game.
Whilst kicking out is absolutely a skill that is valued within the team it’s now easier than ever given the freedom the person kicking in is now afforded. Not easy to be great at it, but easy to pad a stat. Again, that’s not to say I don’t value it very highly - but regardless of how well some of us might use them stats constantly decide best players, medals for games and so on. People are lazy with stats regardless of how much we protest in here and swear that’s not us. Stats influence how players are viewed on a minute to minute basis in the footy community, we shouldn’t be willingly distorting them. Just my take.


He DID say “those in the know” so that would exclude them.


You monster! That would take most of the possessions away from our mids over the last 15 or so years.

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And if you want the mute club version of the game: go to 26:30 for a better view of the Draper/Mo22ie goal. Not sure why they didn’t take this footage from the old boardroom balcony as opposed to the stand.

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Injured. Out for 4 weeks

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Didn’t anyone tell him that it’s only our forwards who are getting injured this year?

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