The list is not expected to play or win finals right now. Especially given the injuries to our young talls who would fill vital roles.
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We have a lot of list changes to make, and not much draft talent to work with.
Imo we need to be strategic about targeting older players on short term deals (possibly with development coach pathways) and really look to improve the playing culture and professionalism of the playing group.
Weâre not going to set our list up with 3 gun players in this draft.
So why not sort out our culture now. This is an important part of the rebuild.
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Well if we could magically wave the culture wand and sort it out, sure. But I do hope we actually address some of these holes. Iâm not opposed to bringing in more leaders by the way. The leadership group of Merrett, Redman, McGrath and Langford is pretty underwhelming.
Keeping the picks likely means weâre in a better position now. Given it seems pretty clear his orders were to improve the team for 2018-2019, they would have been pretty much useless for that goal.
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Poor Adrian always being told what to do against his will
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The biggest hole of this list is lack of culture and leadershipâŚâŚ not small forwards or Key forwards, etc.
Filling positional holes isnât even a top priority for the shitshow that this list is.
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Any thoughts on who we should try and bring over?
Given the Vozzo connection, I wouldnât be surprised if weâre talking to Yeo.
But he may prefer to go to a contender
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I agree with this, but in general we just donât have a superstar on our list that can turn a game, elite level talent.
Even our girls team has stars like prespakis, toogood and Nanscawen.
Our menâs team just has no superstar level talent. Iâd be doing anything possible to trade up to pick 1 so we could get Harley Reid. Until we get a player like this into our club, weâre gonna continue to go nowhere
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how many years is it not expected to win finals?
is it forever because our list manager drafts absolute crap?
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we do but he is rarely fit and only turns it on against the bottom sides.
This is entirely it.
Worst thing that we could have done this year was win a bunch of games early to make other supporters think we were getting closer, and to ruin our chances in the Harley Reid cup. (That said I wanted to win every game and would hate to have actually tanked, but stillâŚ). At the start of the year, most on here thought we were a âbottom 4 listâ but with the ability to contend for the bottom end of the 8 if we I proved in a few areas and had a bit of luck.
That is where we ended up, but the fact that at the bye we could somehow see a 4-6 finish as a possibility, given the incredibly even competition, raised expectations.
I think whatâs clear is that our list is young. But not just young, itâs âimmatureâ. Even a bunch of the older guys donât seem to have that in game maturity to recognise when momentum is changing and to affect that. It is also capable of playing some very good football. Football that absolutely can contend for finals, if they could put it together for 4 quarters. (My reference point for this is the 3rd quarter on Anzac Day. In front of 100,000 people we dominated a team that at that time was pretty much the best in the league. Not just scrapped out a lead, but played legitimately high level football. And then we lost). Not being able to put together 4 quarters and a whole season I put down to a number of things. Firstly we are legitimately young and immature. This relates to group fitness (you need a few preseasons to be able to build that level of fitness, as well as strength etc). It relates to group mentality (just that in game experience that you build by losing games after the siren etc). And it related to group depth (guys like Davey were not ready to play their role yet, but weâre playing a bunch of games because it was between them and other kids who werenât ready).
So with our list. A young list that is the result of deliberately trading out of the 2017/18 drafts and then losing a bunch of the guys who would now be the mature leaders after 2020. (We in effect shifted 4 or 5 list spots from being 24ish to being 20ish) whole replacing Joe, Fantasia and Saad with Stinger and Shiel. (Probably why we are missing a mature KPF and a mature small forward). So with this list, to win finals, we need to 1) keep growing, increasing fitness and strength and maturity. 2) full holes. Both the ones we have now, and the ones that will open up over the next 4 years. 3) Get better in coaching and gameplan (that high possession stuff that we were doing in the back half of the year is terrible)
So end result. You can prioritise next year, and try and recruit the mature KP and small forward types to make us more competitive next year. (Even though youâve recruited young players to play those roles and they will be better next year than they were this year). Or you can just accept that we wonât be mature in those positions but be recruiting for the next holes, whatever those may be. (And the challenge is understanding what those are. I have some ideas, but Mrs Frosty is now commenting on me spending all morning typing on my phone)
My final note was this year we all got annoyed about us playing Kelly and Phillips over Baldwin and Bryan. If you pick up (say) McKay and Gresham, be prepared to spend the whole year complaining about them not playing Reid and Davey (or whoever)
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Which of Saad, McKenna, Daniher and Fantasia would you call a leader? Fantasia is the closest to a leader on that list
You mean doing his job?
The list manager role should be a tactical rather than strategic role. If a list manager has an issue with that then theyâre in the wrong job. But at the same time the fans shouldnât complain about the recruiter when they make short/long term moves in line with the clubâs strategic direction.
Yes @Ants. It was evil Worsfold that forced Adrian to trade for Stringer, Smith and Saad.
Adrian implored the club to realise that the list wasnât good enough, but they didnât listen
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When you push for success and fail, with a core of key players who are under 25 leaving, then have to start doing a rebuild (especially with your talls) then youâre not expected to play or win finals for a number of years.
As much as it makes no sense now. The hope would have been that Joe (who had been in the leadership group) would have grown into that.
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I donât know who made the decision on the strategic approach, I just know it should have been above the list managerâs pay grade. If Dodorro made all of those calls then he should be fired, along with everyone above him in the hierarchy.
But Iâve been saying for years whoever made the decision not to do a full rebuild for two decades should be fired.
So would you just go to the draft with 5-6 picks?
Probably not. I really have no idea. Iâd consider those guys you mentioned. Iâd also consider a HBF. My preference would be to get back a younger player for Zerk rather than getting a pick and then picking up an older FA, if that makes sense.
But I havenât really worked out what that looks like, and even if itâs a possibility.
If we were to trade Zerk out, then bring in a 22yo who fills a need (HBF runner with good skills/powerful mid for instance), then add a Cat B ruck. And then go to the drafts with maybe 3 ND picks and a couple of RD picks Iâd be happy enough
I have vague idea of who Iâd be looking at to add, but havenât really formed that up in my mind.
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