Who’s the best mature hbf with pace and skill avaible in a state league?
They’re next years dead wood.
About 4 months ago we obviously deemed that to be Saad El-Hawli. He does seem to have the ability to play just about anywhere though too (wing, half forward, half back). But yeah whether through the draft or trade/FA we need to acquire at least one more, probably two more guys capable of playing off half back. Depending on how they view Lual.
The frustrating thing about Lual is that there were two guys taken just after him in the draft who if we’d drafted them we’d be quite pleased. Both capable of playing half back or wing. Joe Fonti and Joel Freijah.
Still, hopefully he gets the chance to see out his second year, finds some confidence and justifies the selection.
1 Like
Hawthorn managed to get Lloyd Meek, a strong, well built ruckman about to hit his prime years, for essentially nothing. And now he’s a genuine gun.
They traded out Jaeger O’Meara (aka Dylan Shiel equivalent) and in exchange received a future second rounder and Meek.
They then used that future second to trade up to get Josh Weddle.
That is list management mastery.
And ironically, Meek probably had a better year than both of the ruckmen at Fremantle lol. They’d have been better off keeping Meek on 300-400k than Sean Darcy on 800-900k 
20 Likes
For all proposing to blow up the list (not in this camp myself), I’d be curious to understand how you rated the hawks list at the start of the season and the talent on their list?
Think they are the most obvious example of getting a tactically astute coach with a game plan that suits the list and the players buy in to.
I just don’t subscribe to the theory that hawthorn’s list is so much more talented than ours. I don’t believe it is.
3 Likes
We’d have looked very different not missing Parish, Draper, Duursma and Ridley for large chunks of the season plus Wright out suspended not ideal too.
Large amount of talent out…
2 Likes
why?
What is talent exactly?
They are infinitely better kicks and infinitely better runners
For a start.
2 Likes
Hawthorn has had premiership and grand final exposure, in the last 10 years. They have the foundations of a successful game plan to build upon with onfield leaders…… we do not.
Which is why we need to make up for it with elite talent, to over come our historical downfalls.
Mitchell said of his side, they don’t really understand how big a deal it (finals) is so they don’t seem to feel any pressure.
Contrast that with Essendons players and their mental demons.
Are we likely to miraculously overcome those issues with most of these players taking into account all the evidence of the last 5or 6 years?
1 Like
I honestly don’t remember, but I assume not highly. I thought they were on the right path but assumed they were a few years off what they’ve done this year. I’m very surprised with the results they’ve had.
From the other side, I’d be interested to know what you thought about Sam Mitchell in his first year as coach shoving 2 of his B&F top 10 midfielders out the door at age 28 and 29, one of whom was the reigning B&F winner and a Brownlow Medalist?
5 Likes
The example you cited is the real element of Hawthorn which we should be jealous of. A clear vision of what team they wanted to become, what kind of talent they needed and the competency to identify and nurture that talent.
Compare that with us. After four seasons, I think it’s clear that we drafted Cox, a player with an incredibly versatile skillset, with no clear vision on his role in the team. We figured the problem would sort itself out over time. It hasn’t, and he has stagnated in his development.
Furthermore, we draft all kinds of players and tell the world that “one day they can potentially move into the midfield.” The few midfielders we have drafted in the past decade or so, Parish, Hobbs, Tsatas, Clarke etc, we have stubbornly played woefully out of position. Hell, you can go back to Myers, drafted as an inside mid, played by Knights across HBF despite clearly lacking the pace for that role.
3 Likes
Just to line the ages up, Dylan Shiel equivalent if we’d traded him out in 2021.
Is anyone saying their list is so much more talented than ours?
What they have that we clearly don’t is a club aligned long-term strategy that they’ve stuck to for years.
1 Like
For 4 weeks early in the season. So are you using that as an excuse for his pathetic form over 85% of the season?
1 Like
At the time I thought it was a ballzy and shrewd move from Mitchell.
You could see that JOM’s longevity in the game was limited, and Tom Mitchell’s selfish high disposal game wasn’t helping the side.
Newcombe looked like a player, though it appeared they were heading for years of pain to rebuild their midfield and ruck stocks.
Well…Mitchell solved that in 1 off season by making both Will Day and Conor Nash centre square midfielders (masterstrokes).
Add Worpel back to his best form and the bargain basement acquisition of Meek, and that’s as tough a midfield from any era of the game.
Now they’re able to run other players sporadically through the middle (Moore, Mackenzie, Ward, Macdonald etc…)
Well I’ve assumed so, with so many on here wanting to blow up our list. I just don’t see it that way personally, I’m as frustrated as anyone, but I think we have bigger issues than talent and I acknowledge the list needs to improve.
5 Likes
No, he was just added in as an extra player when I remembered he was out for bit too, but I do think when he came back he was playing scared. His suspension was rubbish. I honestly can’t even remember if we won or lost when he was out. Probably went 4-0 lol.
Kicked 8 goals in first 4 back from suspension but then only 7 in final 8 after that. Yep that’s a big fall off.
Not sure the reason for that, but hazard a guess it was the ever changing forward structure, we didn’t get that thing set and consistent at all, injuries to key players and the very bad ball movement especially into fifty, as we didn’t struggle to get it into fifty, but the way we did really sucked.
The hawks players on paper looked ■■■■ but then once you watch them play, you can clearly see they know how to use the footy
Compare their ball use out of defence, with Sicily, Amon, Hardwick, impey and weddle against laverde, McKay, mcgrath, Kelly, heppell and Martin
Truly chalk and cheese
That’s even before I’ve even looked at their small forwards against ours
9 Likes
Spot on.
They have a well balanced list.
We do not.
Dodoro’s refusal to invest in a quality small forward says it all. He had no f*cking idea
4 Likes