You don’t know that. We could ■■■■■■ well win the premiership this year for all we know. We might not have the same list as Hawthorn but we don’t know yet. Personally I’m quite bouyed by the list state. As I said, it all depends on how we perform this year and next.
We are a quality ruckman away from being a genuine threat.
Would be enquiring about Brayden Peuss after today.
What about the development of the kids that play alongside Kelly though? What he does for the kids both on and off field is the greatest asset that he brings to the team.
1 Like
Why do you have my shoes as your avatar?
Not every single player needs to play their formative years alongside a mentor just to ensure they make it as a player. Plenty haven’t and get on just fine. You don’t need to have one backman, one mid and one fwd as an old man just so “young players can learn.” Have them on the list and they can teach on the training track, or hire Kel as an assistant coach.
I’m exaggerating, clearly, because it’s not like Kelly doesn’t contribute with the ball or anything but that whole “■■■ he teaches us SO much” isn’t a great reason to keep him occupying a precious one of 3/4/5 spots in the 22 we should be - in my opinion - using to blood the next crop.
I get we’re all excited at how we’ve started, but when we narrowly make finals and get beaten in a final this year, then do the same next year or get unlucky and miss out again because Jobe/Stants/Kelly/Goddard have regressed, THEN they all retire and we’re left without anyone to replace them and all of a sudden we’ve wasted 2 years - then we’ll all be whinging at how Zach and Orazio are wasting the prime of their careers without a strong 16-22 range players to elevate them to contender status.
1 Like
No-one thinks that Ben Howlett is the next best forward pocket. Fantasia, Tippa and Green are all ahead of him and several years younger. All of them played round 1, one of them got injured and Howlett had the best form of the reserve players vying for that spot.
Begley has done little since he tore apart some other kids in a practice match in February. Give him a chance to get some semblance of form before he gets a debut.
Redman got a taste of senior level last year. If he wants to get back in now he needs to earn it.
We spent all of last year giving games to kids and giving them big roles. Merrett, Fantasia, Parish, Langford, McGrath are all under 22 and Hartley and Tippa have only played one season of AFL. The first two are clearly young stars and would get a game anywhere, but that’s still a third of the team right now who don’t have a lot of senior football under their belts.
I’m all for giving games to the kids, but while the list is relatively healthy lets make them earn it.
6 Likes
I’m sorry, but I can’t see how anyone can view the list definitively one way or another yet. With 10 senior players working back from injury. With 30 odd players having last played under the saga. With 9 players taken in the top 30 of the last three drafts and only two of them having significant senior time yet. With a coach who we’ve only seen under extreme circumstances in 2016. With 3-5 mature players with less than 50 games figuring out their way. With players getting match fitness and knowledge of each other. When we don’t know if we’ll be a destination club or laughing case by year’s end. When success and treatment of older players effects the ability to attract FAs.
Do we need to keep an eye on the future? Of course. Will a number of guys be in danger if they don’t show something in the seniors this year? Yes. Should we start tanking now to get games into youngsters? Hell no.
We should continue what we’ve been doing. Playing a mix of experienced older players and talented youngsters who have shown enough to get a game. And find out how good or mediocre the list is.
6 Likes
Is Erin Phillips available?
Her wife says no.
2 Likes
There’s your straw man
1 Like
Your suggesting deliberately weakening the 2017 side to improve the 2019 side. Especially as you seem to be suggesting multiple changes and kids who are barely into the system and not yet standing out at VFZl into the deep end. Sorry, but that is clearly tanking to me. Now, I’m fine with tanking. I think we didn’t do it enough in the 2005-2008 period. But I don’t think the timing now is right.
I’m suggesting playing a team that’s 95%-ish strength so that in 2 years our 100% strength side is wayyyyy better than what it’d otherwise be. That’s not tanking to me, that’s planning for the future.
2 Likes
HAP’s OP proposed “not going flat chat”.
You’re suggesting weakening a team that is already giving substantial weight to players in their 1st to 3rd seasons.
HAP suggested bringing in Howlett or other journeyman a mistake.
And let’s be honest, if you want to make substantial differences to the 2019 side 5% (1player in the side) ain’t going to cut it.
Given what we’re already doing and the preference for youth over experience, what HAP and you are suggesting goes beyond tinkering to derailing and tanking. I do not think that is appropriate given where the list is at.
2 Likes
It’s a shame our coaching and drafting personell can’t understand this simple logic.
1 Like
I should be clear that I think there are times to focus on future first. I mentioned above I proposed it at the end of 2015. And as more of the 2015/2016 draftees start challenging for places and older players slow down, I may agree with it. But right now, I think we need to learn what a pour best actually looks like, what weaknesses we have, before going full throttle on youth.
1 Like
Freo got smashed again yesterday, come on down Nat Fyfe
Are we all ready for a “That’s a Big Call” for today.
I think a fit a firing Aaron Francis IS the difference between us winning at least 2 finals this season. Yep…I said it.
Looking at the best 22, I can’t see a true X-factor player that can win a game off his own boot hird, long style. Daniher maybe, walla? But both those players rely on folks up field. There just isn’t a player that can turn a game in the space of 15 minutes.
If Francis can break into the side by mid season, my hope is he can run riot as a third string forward like we’ve seen at times in the reserves. When he’s on, he could be unstoppable. The competition won’t know what hit it.
1 Like
I think a large part of that is already in place: unlike in the past, the opposition really need to choose who to focus on now. If Francis is cherry on the top — you can’t ignore Joe or Cale, or the mosquitoes buzzing around them — he could put us in a very good place.
4 Likes
Not sure where I read it, but someone made the comment that the 2013 draft has saved us. Getting Zach and Raz for the picks we had is an insane return. Both are/will be elite footballers. Imagine if we had’ve drawn blanks at those picks and both those players were delisted at the end of last season. That leaves a gaping hole in our list. I think we have a decent blend of players in terms of youth coming through and also experience. In our 22 at the weekend we had Zach, Raz, Parish, Walla, Hartley, Langford, McGrath, Gleeson, Joey. That’s 9/22 that are young players who’s best football is still ahead of them, and we haven’t even counted the likes of Francis, Lav, etc. There is plenty to like about that. I think we are 5th in the AFL in terms of average age/games played, but from 5th-10th there is like 3-4 months difference. Retirtements of the likes of Jobe, Stants, BJ if and when they occur over the next couple of years changes our profile a fair bit. Realistically we probably have to make a big splash in the FA market to push ourselves to that next level. A strong 2017 will sell the club very nicely to any potential big names.
Couple of thoughts:
So much of our short term recruiting depends on how our ruck division performs this year. Another 20 game season for Leuenberger, and we’re ok, but if he can only get through 13 like he has averaged for his career, and Belly doesn’t come on, then we need to think long and hard about making a big play for someone younger and more durable. Gawn is 25, Grundy is 22 - and I’m tipping them (and Naitanui) to be the dominant ruckman of the next 5 years. Are they gettable? Probably not, but surely they’re worth a try.
IF we get consistent footy out of the Bell-Berger pairing, then we need to look at where our next biggest hole is. Our 30+ blokes are already scaling back a bit to be rotation players, and the trio of Hepp, Zerrett, Parish is a good replacement for Jobe, Stants, and BJ. The 27-29 year olds are next to go: Hocking, Baguley, the Bell-Berger combo, Hooker, Howlett, Myers, Zaka
Hardly breaking news, but we need a ruckman, and we will need inside mids.
2 Likes