Well didn’t this escalate fast
what the ■■■■
I actually went to school and played footy against Adam and his brothers.
Adam was always humble, and never had a bad word to say about anyone. He always had that eyre of confidence about him, and was a leader.
The booing thing was difficult, as so many people where booing about different things. Most where not ratially motivated I’m sure.
But of course the society we live in. With the media the way it is made it all seem like it was.
A said situation really.
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At the risk of seeming to take sides here, can I just say, as an “independent” reader of this thread (meaning no real preconceived opinion either way) @The_Ant, you are hurting your case by the arguments you are making. @wimmera1 has a valid point of view and you won’t see it, due to your outraged indignation.
We all decry the concept of racial discrimination, you, wim, me and 99% of thinking people.
Whether Adam Goodes is good ambassador for the promotion of that ideal is a divisive and controversial issue.
PS I don’t agree that whenever an indigenous person interprets something as racist, then it automatically is racist, and must stop. The true meaning of a statement belongs in the mind of the speaker, and if a hearer interprets it in a way the speaker did not intend, it is the hearer who has it wrong.
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Thanks Jodi.
Your last comments exemplifies the issue. Hey Indigenous people, here is what racism is. It wasn’t racism you heard it wrong.
Watch the doco and you will hear what Adam Goodes heard from our none-racist country.
It’s amazing how a bit of booing upsets so many people. If Goodes thought it was racially based- he is entitled to his opinion and to feel that way
If people want to boo him because they don’t like the guy or how he plays then just deal with it. Maybe there there was 1% of people who booed him because of his colour which is disgusting. But don’t paint all those who booed him with the racist brush becuase that is downright pathetic
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ok, you mercilessly booed him to the point he walked away because you didn’t like the guy.
Fair point. Carry on.
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I’m with u on this one jodi. Although I never would have been able to put it into words the way you did.
The last paragraph you wrote is the interesting one. And opens the real discussion here. Lot of areas of grey in this particular situation.
But that doesn’t mean we dismiss the concerns of someone on the end of a comment or actions perceived as racist. We can’t just say “it wasn’t meant that way so you’re wrong feel upset by it”, we should be open to have critical self-reflection and see it from their point of view.
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What I said about the speaker knowing the true meaning of his own statement, and the hearer having it wrong if he takes a different meaning, is just a fact. Speakers know their own meaning. Hearers interpret. Nothing to do with racism, or this debate.
Adam Goodes almost certainly interpreted all the antagonism he was getting as racist, and given the history of the issue, you can hardly blame him.
But he would be really showing the sort of leadership that warrants an Australian of the Year award if he would acknowledge that his first gut reaction to criticism (that it is racially motivated) might not always be right.
If he would get up and say “You know, if you are booing me because I’m aboriginal, that is very, very wrong, and I won’t stand for it”, I would respect him like I respect Michael Long, Nicky Winmar and David Wirrpanda.
I can see how he was goaded into a reaction like the spear throwing war dance, but it was the wrong thing to do. He should have apologised when he had time to think about it, and say that he wanted all Australians to come together and stamp out discrimination, rather than sending a message that seemed to promote the idea of antagonism of the indigenous race towards the non indigenous. That is what an Australian of the Year should have done.
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Yeah I think the problem is that it was almost certainly more than 1% being racist.
I’ve never booed Goodes, and if I heard anyone yelling racist stuff I’d like to think I’d tell them to pull their head in. I’d not boo him for just being on the field because there’s not really a great reason to boo like that unless it’s being racist.
But if he slid in knees first or won the game by staging for a free, I’d feel free to boo. Frankly I probably wouldn’t anyway and if there was incessant no-reason-but-racist booing going on, that’d put me off even if I was inclined to because of a specific act. But if nothing overtly racist was going on and he did something on field that was the act of a tool (and he sure did them), then I would say boo as you wish. Because if booing erupted at the moment he did something tool-ish and he reckoned that was a race thing, then that would be stupid.
And I’d be happy to tell him that I thought that was reasonable over a cup of tea.
Jodi can I clarify your point so I’m sure I understand it.
After being booed for a year, after stating he felt it was racially driven, after being verbally abused for half a game by the opposition crowd in the pocket, Adam should apologise for throwing an imaginary spear that hurt the feelings of the white people in the crowd.
Is this correct?
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I’m still not sure if KFC showing West Indians eating chicken to promote cricket is racist.
Do they have the footage of Goodes nailing Hirdy just standing there from behind with an elbow into the back that dropped him?
I don’t agree entirely with this either, though it is less extreme than “its racist if I tell you it’s racist”.
I think it’s a lot more nuanced than that.
The “ape” comments are flat out racist, regardless of the speakers intent. Booing is not racist. They are distinct acts. There’s no cultural justification for booing being race based, but not so for the ape comparisons.
Some people booed because he’s indigenous. Others didn’t.
100 percent of all people who have compared darker skinned people to apes are racist. It may be overt, it may be oblivious, but they’re just two different flavours of prejudice.
I agree entirely though that there’s no gains in telling people they are racist when they are clearly not. Overuse of terms such as “privilege” diminish what is a very real problem. It enables the ignoramus “Social justice warrior… Ultra PC… what about mah freeeeedums” crowd to knock down genuine examples.
Difficult to get across succinctly in text, because nuanced.
kinda expected diggers to go to town on this.
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I’d like to very respectfully remind you that the people want collared guernseys so walla can pop it more often. yet here we are…
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People really like to explain their motivations behind booing Goodes.
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Do you think in part because they’re well aware of who they are and what they believe?