Some threads.
Others went off the books a long time ago.
And a lot of the storylines in the books diverged from any sort of story a long time ago, too.
In the books, Dani’s spent 2 books battling crappy internal politics, then just wandering around the desert by herself. He must’ve stuffed up some of his storyboards, he’s padding for time.
It could have if they didn’t give the Night King the Darth Maul treatment and been in a rush to kill him off.
Season 8 isn’t just a few episodes too short, it’s at least a series too short to do justice to the first few series. Having said that, I reckon 6 and 7 were struggling too so I doubt the writing would have drastically improved with the appearance of season 9.
There’s just so much wrong with the story telling. It’s like the writers increasingly struggled to know how the story progressed and eventually just gave up on everything between the books and a preconceived ending. How they got there ceased to matter in terms of logical progression in the Westeros world. In the process, all sense of epicness was thrown away. It became a really poorly plotted show interspersed with some good scenes. I actually wonder if this is the problem with Martin - has he created a world beyond his ability to ever coherently tie it all off? Pretty sure there’s no Night King in the books though?
Case in point:. The High Sparrow garbage drifted along for more than a series. The Night King and Walkers gained a dragon, lost a dragon and was exterminated in about three episodes, and had little screen time in the process. It’s great that Arya vanquished him, but the lead in and build up was utterly wasteful. Appalling decision making from whoever did it.
Edit: I could go on and on about the failures of the screenwriters. But I won’t.
You could say the same thing about Bolton.
Great and all, but the White Walkers was what the series was actually about.
And they’re vanquished in one battle with no ground given, somehow negative zero casualties and zero stress to Westeros.
I don’t hate the last two seasons.
I appreciate that they got an ending at all, and a relatively satisfying one.
But hell yeah it was rushed.
Not sure Bran (by very nature of what he is) can have his strings pulled surreptitiously?
I thought the ending was good, but the path that they took to get there was a bit Steve Bradbury-esque.
Yeah, I reckon those last two seasons would stand out horribly on a full series binge.
I re-watched the last few episodes the other week, just to see how I felt with all the emotion taken out of it, hoping I’d feel better about the ending.
Nup, it’s worse than I remembered.
The show started losing me in season 5 with those godawful Dorne scenes. Characters started becoming caricatures and things became increasingly cheap, lazy and nonsensical. It completely shat the bed in seasons 7 and 8 though.
The show went from having battles occur off-screen to save time and money for a properly fleshed-out narrative to literally reducing seasons to 6 episodes each so they could pour all their resources into “epic battle scenes”. The dialogue, characterization, and politicking were what made the story great and there was no longer any care given to that. It just completely lost its way.
It did. And character development and organic motives were jettisoned in favour of reaching the pre decided endgame. Which meant neither the characters nor their actions were any longer consistent in any way, and imo it was all for nought because the ending was also not satisfying - or even reasonable- in any way. Even Snow became a largely wooden character wedged into a spot he didn’t fit.
This doesn’t apply to me because I’m not one, but I imagine the most interesting thing now will be for devotees of the books. Presumably the major plot points were given to the writers by Martin, but does he take the novels in a totally different direction? As I understand it, there’s no Night King so presumably the entire Wall storyline should inevitably be different anyway. Thankfully, because it’s that brooding and ill defined menace that I think was the real strength of the early TV series. Far more interesting and open to great possibilities than Danys tale.
But also , does he (Martin) ever even get this thing finished? Even if he knows how, he’s incredibly slow at getting it out. That’ll be worse if the show has made him want to rewrite various threads. That must worry a lot of fans. At least Tolkien finished his major tome, and the posthumous releases were more about the developing of the background and side stories. If this bloke has a heart attack tomorrow the only finished item is a half baked tv show.
He won’t get it (series) finished. He has said that when he sits down in the morning and goes through what he has done so far in the world of Westerhos its nearly midnight. He has created an epic monster of a series and way too many side projects that he is working on like prequels and collaborations on other books.
Publisher is getting ■■■■■■ that he pushes back deadlines with a ‘I don’t care attitude’. 8 years already between The Winds and the last book.
He has confirmed he might do this. As far as I am aware he gave them the general idea of what he wanted as the ending but wasnt completely sold on that being the definitive one.
On the positive front:
The Hound was my clear favourite character. Flawed, murderous, sardonic, world weary and a fleeting core of right and wrong, I loved this bloke. He kept me going through some unenjoyable episodes. . Not far behind was Ayra, whom was beautifully done by Williams. A psychopathic nutter in child form who was somehow both utterly remorseless and also quaintly funny at times. Despite some misgivings for even these two at the hands of the writers late, I thought they were fairly consistent. Not 100% sold on how the Hound was wrapped up, but that was more about some flaws in what they made Gregor than what Sandor did.
The early seasons were outright great, as much due to the constant, but largely latent, tension present. Having never read the books, Neds fate was totally jarring to me, and The Black Watch storyline promised so much in ambience by only hinting obliquely at what they faced.
Sansa grew on me, transitioning from timid and helpless to very self aware and ruthless. Very plausibly done.
Ygritte was a very engaging character, ironic humour in just the right measure.
I thought Bran was largely underutilized for a role that held so much promise, but I was intrigued by the idea he represented. I’m still not really clear on his true value/place within Westeros though. The previous Raven lived for eons and became part tree?
The White Walkers were far more menacing than their King once he arrived, imo. They could/should have expanded heavily on them, and for me the adventures beyond the wall were more interesting and “mythological” than the Dragon Queen travails. Wanted to see more of them and their effect on those on and North of the wall.
I thought Snow was a great character until late.
I don’t think I’ve seen a character on TV that I’ve more wanted to see die than Joffrey. And then Ramsay showed up. I found some of the violence/cruelty gratuitous (especially S3 iirc) and uncalled for, but I cannot deny I was invested in their demise.
And Cersei. I thought Lena Headey was outstanding with the character (again, writing failings late weren’t her doing), a threatening, brooding sociopath of a woman. Arguably the best drawn character in consistency from S1 to S8, though perhaps I underplay Tyrion a touch.
I’m glad we did the hard yards and watched it all. I can see why some laud it as one of TV’s great shows. And also why some think it a great disappointment. I’d say it managed to be both across it’s run time.
Oh absolutely.
It was originally conceived and plotted as a trilogy. Essentially Stark v Targaryen v Lannister.
He’s added about 10 characters/storylines that he had no idea how to finish, so they just sort of peter out.
Pretty sure night king was part of the original books though, he’s mentioned by Old Nan right at the start.
As I understand it, The Night’s King in the book is entirely different to the shows Night King. But I guess Martin has thousands of pages in which to introduce a lord of White Walkers.
He’s only really hinted at, but he’s there.
I think his biggest issue isnt the size of the world, just he has fingers in different projects. I get the brain break but ffs get it done.
Is this…a bad thing?
Wait and see on the GOT spin-off. Can’t say I’m particularly excited about more Star Wars movies by the person who gave us TLJ. Hopeful for The Mandolorian though.
I hope so. 