So random Israeli’s go around shooting up and bombing Palestinians?
Clearly I’m not keeping up with the news as I’ve not seen anything about that.
1 Like
Oh no, they’re not random Israeli’s.
They’re members of the IDF
And why do these IDF members do such things…are the Palestinians in the area as other Palestinians are attacking the IDF?
1 Like
Does it matter why members of one of the most well-funded and well-resourced armed forces in the world are shooting at children?
1 Like
But how can that happen when various Palestinian groups continue to call for the total destruction of the Jewish State?
Such a simplistic and emotional statement.
If it were just that then the whole world would condemn the Israelis…but it’s a lot more than that…isn’t it?
How often is it that the Israelis are the instigators of the violence that occurs there?
Should they just sit back and let the Palestinians attack their settlements and people?
3 Likes
This is a problem which Israel has inflicted on itself.
2 Likes
By existing?
Feel free to add nuance to the event of trained armed forces shooting at children. 29 Palestinian children killed by Israel since start of 2022 – Middle East Monitor
They routinely do in the U.N. The U.S has veto power however and prevents anything meaningful from happening. In 2018, Israel became the most condemned nation at the UN
They were the instigators last year and the Israeli government has routinely broken ceasefire agreements reached with Hamas since the second intifada. Gaza truce broken as Israeli raid kills six Hamas gunmen | Gaza | The Guardian
Israeli settlements are deliberately erected on Palestinian territories, in strategically selected locations to cause the most disruption to the locals while ensuring the Israeli government has access to key resources. Such settlements are also illegal under international law Israel’s settlement policy in the occupied Palestinian territory | American Friends Service Committee
2 Likes
Israel was designed by the European powers in a way that is inherently unstable. By existing, Israel creates problems. That doesn’t mean I blame or dislike the Israeli people, but they were set up to fail. It was an extraordinarily ham fisted and cruel creation to steal a country and give it to another people to alleviate guilt.
It’s complex. It’s messy. Both sides are to blame for a lot of horrible things. And I have a lot of empathy for all involved.
9 Likes
That’s a pretty good summation (imo).
1 Like
Imagine being on the side of Hamas…
I don’t think many are on the side of Hamas, but I can definitely understand why Palestinian people are driven into their arms. Understanding someone and agreeing with them are two very different things.
8 Likes
Israel has justified bombing of civilian residences on the grounds that the locations harbour terrorist HQ.
It’s the harassment factor, when supply of water and energy get cut to villages, the checkpoints limiting movement.
Israel promotes itself as a bastion of democracy in the Middle East. But shelters Russian oligarchs and has refused to provide military aid to Ukraine.
But it takes offence at being called out.
Ukraine was chipped for supporting a UN vote to conduct an inquiry into settlements outside its borders. It has expressed displeasure with the the US investigation into the killing of a US citizen working as an Al Jazeera journalist.
It refuses to extradite an oligarch who cleaned out the Moldova Banking system.
1 Like
No one is on the side of Hamas. Their rhetoric does themselves and the Palestinians they govern no favors. Their actions, whether justified or not, bring the Israeli hammer down on those same Palestinians.
Let’s not overplay them though. They’re only governing the ever-diminishing Gaza Strip and have a longstanding rivalry with the Palestinian Authority of the West Bank. Speaking up for Palestinians is not the same as supporting Hamas.
What this is about is recognizing the huge power imbalance between the Israeli government and the factions which represent the Palestinian people, and recognizing that the cycle of violence is the natural result of the conditions enforced upon the Palestinians by Israel.
2 Likes
It would appear that we have opposing viewpoints re who is to blame for the ongoing violence.
I agree that the Israelis are far from being blameless…but the majority of the violence is instigated by the Palestinians…Hamas fires rockets from suburban neighbourhoods into Israel…Israel will always hit back…and Palestinian civilians suffer as a result.
2 Likes
Israel has built a level of military supremacy over their region that is unmatched. They can do anything within their sphere of influence without counter.
That has left their government in a position that they aren’t mature enough to deal with. When you are on the strong side of a power imbalance, you can do almost anything, but that doesn’t mean you should. They face very real threats and use a range of harsh measures to protect themselves. That harshness helps them in the short term, but long term builds resentment and weakens support.
5 Likes
I disagree that Palestinians are the primary instigators, but I’m happy to leave it there as an agree-to-disagree.
Israel as the overwhelming power in the region has the responsibility however to ensure that civilians have adequate access to resources. This includes the Palestinian Territories, and has been recognised as such by the U.N.
I believe that positively affecting the material conditions of these people will to far more to end the violence than any overwhelming show of force could.
5 Likes
It is a very violent part of the world and historically the early Israeli settlers used extreme and overt violence effectively to gain control. They are mostly more subtle now and use displacement as an act of violence to gain lands.
No doubt that Palestinians do much to continue the conflict, but in context Israel should be viewed as an occupying force. Shooting kids for throwing rocks is over the top.
I have been there many times and have many close Israeli friends. Great people with a certain arrogance about their military power.
First went there in 1975: always been right of centre in politics
1 Like
Of course you are on the side of Hamas.
You and others like Heffsgirl swallow their propaganda whole and regurgitate it mind-numbingly, trying to compare a country whose primary aim is to protect its citizens with a people who murder Israelis and their own citizens with impunity for being Homosexual or for “family honour” reasons (having an affair).
The Israeli army is not perfect and are stuck in a situation like no other in the world.
I didn’t vote for the current government and am worried that due to the fact that the religious people have many children on one hand, and the Palestinians have no intention of living in peace with Israel, that there will never be another non right wing government.
This was tried in Oslo accords. The response was a record number of bus bombing and hundreds
murdered.
Any attempt to assign Western values and concepts of life values to the Palestinians and many other non-western people is unproductive. They simply don’t have the same objectives as you and me in life - peace, prosperity, family, ethics, etc.
We see this in US attempts to force democracy on Iraq, Afghanistan and elsewhere.
Using such nonsensical and emotive terms like Apartheid and child killers just makes you look like simpleton extreme leftist ignoramuses.
The situation is so much more nuanced.
2 Likes