Middle East Discussion

Thank you for your measured response.

If I come across in this thread as being imbalanced it’s because I’m trying to bring another side to what I sometimes observe as being an echo chamber (in this thread).

I think there is a misconception that because Israel is superior militarily to Palestinians that they are automatically the ‘bad guy’ this scenario. While still imperfect, I believe there are some obvious differences that make Israel the morally superior of the two and the more committed to genuine peace. I realise others may see it differently but any culture that incentivises and celebrates the indiscriminate killing of civilians is a broken one.

I think there is a lot of pain and suffering on both sides and hope - like I’m sure we all do - that circumstances can improve for all concerned.

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Yep. The unfair reality is that any use of force by Israel will be judged to a different standard than violence directed at Israel.

But that also creates opportunities. If Israel sold itself as obsessively focused on avoiding civilian casualties, that reputation would build over time. Every time there’s a civilian or reporter or whoever killed by Israeli military action, it creates a massively powerful propaganda weapon. By obsessing about the details, showing restraint and focus, it would reduce the blow back that use of force always results.

Do that for long enough. Stay on message long enough. Build a reputation. Eventually the neighboring countries will open up more and more to Israel. The Islamic world as a whole will likely force Palestinians to moderate, but Israel has a key role to make that landscape viable.

My issue with your arguments is the generalisation that Palestinians as a homogeneous group want to see the end of Israel. My Palestinian friends do not. They want peace and believe in the right of the State of Israel existing. They are desperate for an outcome that brings peace side by side.

I acknowledge your situation that you believe all Palestinians want an end to Israel. My engagements with Palestinians, albeit a small sample size suggests otherwise and I have no reason to distrust what they say.

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I am not sure that anyone could believe this at all, as as far back as 1988 when Fatah proclaimed independence as a government-in-exile, it recognized the existence of the State of Israel, rejected terrorism, and embraced a two-state solution. Fatah pursued negotiations with Israel, and in 1993 Israel and the PLO signed the Oslo Accord peace agreement. Benjamin Netanyahu has been as complicit as Hamas in making sure that has not worked.

All the Palestinians and Israelis I know want peace, and to live in co-existance with each other.

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On 30 November UNGA voted to hold a commemorative event to mark the 75th anniversary of Nakba Day.
The vote was 90-30, with 47 abstentions. Australia, Canada , UK , USA and EU members ( except for Cyprus) opposed.
Netflix has been copping some heat for streaming the film Nakba ( by a Jordanian film maker). Netflix is also streaming some Palestinian films.
The Nakba film has been screened in Jaffa.

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To be confirmed, but potentially a fantastic step.

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As reported on its online site, Al Jazeera has lodged a request to the ICC to investigate and prosecute those responsible for the killing of its journalist ( Jerusalem born and a resident, a US citizen)
The request has been presented in the context of wider attacks on Al Jazeera and journalists in Palestine.
The family had earlier lodged a complaint to the ICC, supported by the Palestine Journalists Association and the International Journalists Federation.
In September last year the ICC determined that it had jurisdiction in regard to the situation in Palestine territory.

US judge reluctantly discontinues court proceedings against MBS for the Kashoggi killing.
Biden Administration determined that, as a sitting head of State of a foreign government, he enjoys head of State immunity from US jurisdiction.
MBS was only officially decreed HOS of Saudi Arabia in September.
Putin should be safe for a while.

Why would the US issue any court hearings against MBS, seeing the offence occurred in Turkey - Surely it is a matter for Turkish authorities.

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Universal Jurisdiction, principle of international law.
It was applied to Pinochet.
Fact sheet on universal jurisdiction can be accessed on this site

ccrjustice.org

The case was brought by the fiancée and others.

The Economic and Social Committee of the UN has voted to suspend Iran from its Commission for Women

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Qatar has taken offence at being the sole country named in the EU Parliament bribery scandal, including loss of diplomatic access to Parliament and suspension of visa arrangements.
It has reminded Belgium, which took the bribery actions, that Qatar has been a natural gas supplier to the EU.

Energy blackmail as a defence for bribery charges. Sure. That’ll work.

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It only cost $200bn to stage the World Cup, not counting the price paid to secure it for Qatar.
Between 2012-2022 it has provided $48 million in aid for internally displaced and refugees at the international level.

I’m tipping the real figure will never made public but I think $200bn is pretty conservative and it would well over that IMO.

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Sigh

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Iran was on a ‘Commission for Women’?

I think countries get voted on to UN Committees for fixed terms. There could be countries with far more repressive regimes towards women.

Afghanistan is also a member state and they are leading the way by suspending education to girls.

PDF with the list of members:

Hadn’t heard of Cabo Verde before. Apparently has a population of Sephardi Jews. How’d they get there, Gabe?