The problem is that all of Hurley, Carlisle and Hooker are all much much better defenders than they are forwards.
And they should all end up there when Fletcher retires at the end of the year. Hooker and Carlisle key defenders, with Hurley playing the sweeper / quarterback role that Fletcher plays.
Our forward line anchored by Daniher, a resting ruck and a brigade of smaller players / resting mids.
Still early days but as it stands I agree with you 100%
Sadly though, Daniher is still raw and doesn't have the body to command the forward line to himself.
you hit the nail on the head. Hurley has been good so far (except tonight when he got absolutely pansted!!)
Carlisle has been very poor, he has no confidence up forward at all. You can just tell from his body language. He has gone from being a very very good backmen to a rubbish forward. The other guy has gone from being a decent forward to a good defender.FARK
Neither are forwards really I don't think.
Hurley definitely isn't. Jake doesn't look like a forward but still early days. Persist for a while with Carlisle up forward. I think having bellchambers back will make a big difference
Belly returning provides a sense of presence that is lacking at the moment. Hurley has menace but no presence in the F50. Carlisle at the moment has neither. This is a thread that is looking at only one small issue. The bigger issue here is one that was identified pre-season, we have a make shift forward line at the moment, and swapping Hurley / Buckets was only ever a band aid solution. Hurley / Buckets / Hooker are all better defenders than forwards, which makes our defence sound, but the search for bona fide forwards will go on, as it must. For now, we have to keep planning for long term success. Expect Carlisle to stay forward at this stage. Hurley was serviceable tonight, against an opponent who is in red hot form, and playing as well as he ever has. Against the midfield pressure tonight, the makeshift forward line did the same disappearing act it tried out last week. Carlisle / Hurley forward back is not the issue here.
I'd just like them to play at least 1 of them actually in the forward line. It is absolutely pointless having Jake & Joe roaming up the ground & then expecting them to sprint back forward & make possition. Their strength is their height - use it. They are both mobile for their height BUT they are not more mobile than the majority of defenders who are smaller & quicker. They will not outrun most defenders & so end up stationery targets with 2-3 defenders jumping all over them - its stupidity. Have 1 of them starting deeper so they can at least have the option of leading at the ball carrier.
I thought Carlisle was showing some really good signs as a forward before he got forced to start rucking. Against North he had 19 possessions, 7 marks, 2 shots (both behinds) and 2 more goal assists. Against Hawthorn he had 19 possessions, 10 marks, kicked 2.2 and had another goal assist. He was looking very lively for someone just learning the forward craft. Then he had to start playing in the ruck. Sure, he pantsed Warnock, but against Freo and then St Kilda he got less than 10 possessions each game, 6 marks between the two matches, and not a single scoring shot or goal assist in the two matches. The problem is not Carlisle forward. The problem is no ■■■■■■ ruck cover. Thompson’s decision not to promote Thurlow even for just the two weeks has really hit us hard. Carlisle going forward was always going to take some time to embed, and having to ruck is not, and has not helped. Being one out vs. Sandilands in 30+ heat probably exacerbated the issue. So can we all stop running around like headless chickens?
Carlisle is an AA defender, Hurley plays solidly in defence. I would be focussing on Bellchambers, Hardingham and Daniher as our main forwards. This means Fletcher needs to be thinking about the young players a bit more, in my opinion.
Hardingham is not the answer. It's taken teams less than 3 weeks to figure him out - put someone good in the air on him. We all thought he'd be the perfect match up - tough in the air, mobile on the ground. But Freo and the Saints have shown that actually if you nullify him in the air, he isn't proving any more mobile/agile than his opponent. He may be better when Carlisle/Belly/JD are all taking the three best marking forwards, but he ain't no Crameri and can't hold one of the 3 tall spots himself.
What’s the bet Hooker plays rubbish now, because he switched.
I’d like them to stay in one position. All of them. Whatever that position is.
I’ve never been a fan of Carlisle forward, and it’d panned out pretty much as I thought it would, but again, it’s too early to really make a call. It was never gonna work straight away anyway.
We gave Hurley four years, give Carlisle at least one.
I'd just like them to play at least 1 of them actually in the forward line. It is absolutely pointless having Jake & Joe roaming up the ground & then expecting them to sprint back forward & make possition. Their strength is their height - use it. They are both mobile for their height BUT they are not more mobile than the majority of defenders who are smaller & quicker. They will not outrun most defenders & so end up stationery targets with 2-3 defenders jumping all over them - its stupidity. Have 1 of them starting deeper so they can at least have the option of leading at the ball carrier.
Got mauled deep by James frigging Gwilt.
Had absolutely no idea whatsoever how to play him, here's the tip, he's going to grapple, get to the front & fall of the ball and at least make it obvious.
Harked back to the good old days of Wambell playing CHB on Lucas and literally not letting go of him until they got in the showers.
Need to get a lot better at figuring out how it's being umpired and adjusting to that.
The Hooker performance tonight sealed it.
When they believe they are the swingman, being sent forward in the last quarter to win the match, they dominate.
We just need to brainwash them into thinking this is always the scenario, and rotate often.
Volleyball style, as soon as one team scores, everybody rotates clockwise.
Carlisle is an AA defender, Hurley plays solidly in defence.
I would be focussing on Bellchambers, Hardingham and Daniher as our main forwards.
This means Fletcher needs to be thinking about the young players a bit more, in my opinion.
Hardingham is not the answer. It's taken teams less than 3 weeks to figure him out - put someone good in the air on him. We all thought he'd be the perfect match up - tough in the air, mobile on the ground. But Freo and the Saints have shown that actually if you nullify him in the air, he isn't proving any more mobile/agile than his opponent. He may be better when Carlisle/Belly/JD are all taking the three best marking forwards, but he ain't no Crameri and can't hold one of the 3 tall spots himself.
LOL who exactly thought or said this in the history of ever?
The Hooker performance tonight sealed it.
When they believe they are the swingman, being sent forward in the last quarter to win the match, they dominate.
We just need to brainwash them into thinking this is always the scenario, and rotate often.
Volleyball style, as soon as one team scores, everybody rotates clockwise.
Yes, because their enthusiasm up forward only lasts about 5 minutes.
We say that Hooker is a better defender than Forward. Hard to say without Hooker spending a few games forward. Gee James Frawley who is a similar player to Hooker has looked good forward in the last two games. We dont need Hooker to be a better forward than defender - If he is nearly as good we have a WINNER.
Yep, they both suck as forwards. Will form a very good defensive unit one day, until then it’s going to be pretty awkward for whoever gets stuck forward.
It probably has to be Hurls who goes forward though in the meantime because jake is better equipped to handle the monster forwards.
And maybe one day when we get that forward line sorted we will then have to have a real good look at those mids who can’t lower the eyes and hit a target.Or maybe they are told to just bomb it in there by our super coaches. It’s a ■■■■■■■ mess whatever it is.
The Hooker performance tonight sealed it.
When they believe they are the swingman, being sent forward in the last quarter to win the match, they dominate.
We just need to brainwash them into thinking this is always the scenario, and rotate often.
What it sealed was that doing the same thing over & over again when its not working is pointless. A change, any change was always going to yeild some level of improvement becuase for 2.5qtrs we allowed Stkilda's defence to dictate terms. It was obvious in the 2nd that our forward line had ceased to function. I have to believe that Carlise & Daniher rarely being even in the forward line MUST be part of the coached structure so the outcome wasn't going to change by magic. Gwilt is farking 13cm shorter than JD, Delaney is 7cm shorter than Carlise so why at no stage did we even try to exploit that advantage by having at least 1 of them stay very deep forward?