Just to Vinnie’s point.
I find it quite possible that ‘magic’ of some description, in some form, is successfully practised around the world.
Most likely in cultures with a rich history in ceremony and ritual. Less likely by guys in a culture who get TV deals for it.
I think a good example of magic is Volition/will.
Where does that come from? Im choosing to do X. And then X happens. so many mystery's right in front of us.
I'm choosing to do XXX. And then XXX happens. It's no mystery.
It's chocolates, flowers and a restaurant.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MU-E3PDRRwU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Mlt9ABjyM8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9s9smBP04Pc
Pretty sure sorcery is real
Mirrors
Odd that none of them have claimed the various millions of prizes offered by various sceptics for proving paranormal phenomena.
Very odd. Guess they don't need it, they can just magic up that sort of money.
Odd that none of them have claimed the various millions of prizes offered by various sceptics for proving paranormal phenomena.
Very odd. Guess they don't need it, they can just magic up that sort of money.
You mean like the world's financial institutions do? :)
I wonder why those "various sceptics" think those coloured pieces of paper with faces and numbers and writing on them have magically taken on value. B)
By the way, Dynamo used his powers to win 10,000 pounds on a multiple soccer bet. Then he gave the money to a charity.
Maybe these guys are smart enough to understand that the monetary system is a fraud and they don't really worship that god.
I dunno, but maybe.
I think a good example of magic is Volition/will.
Where does that come from? Im choosing to do X. And then X happens. so many mystery's right in front of us.
I'm choosing to do XXX. And then XXX happens. It's no mystery.
It's chocolates, flowers and a restaurant.
Be careful, If you keep giving her chocolates XXXL might happen instead.
I think a good example of magic is Volition/will.
Where does that come from? Im choosing to do X. And then X happens. so many mystery's right in front of us.
I'm choosing to do XXX. And then XXX happens. It's no mystery.
It's chocolates, flowers and a restaurant.
Be careful, If you keep giving her chocolates XXXL might happen instead.
Iol.
Sugar free!
Odd that none of them have claimed the various millions of prizes offered by various sceptics for proving paranormal phenomena.
Very odd. Guess they don't need it, they can just magic up that sort of money.
You mean like the world's financial institutions do? :)
I wonder why those "various sceptics" think those coloured pieces of paper with faces and numbers and writing on them have magically taken on value. B)
Look over there!!
Quite apt, really.
Vinnie, magic isn't a thing, a noun, it's an adjective, basically describing something you don't understand.
I am sure that our aborigines originally thought guns and matches were magic, but it was just advanced technology. It WAS magic to them though. Hell, TV and computers and even landline phones are a deadset miracle if you ask me. How the fark does a remote control for the tv work??
Some people are double jointed, can hold their breath for an extraordinarily long time, or a missing a finger, or have a hole through their chest or tongue from misadventure or choice, it's not magic when they exploit it, it's just messing with your expectations.
Some tricks make use of contraptions and extensive, meticulous planning. In fact a lot of tricks you'd think "the only way they could have done that was to stick that coin into an orange when it was little and then let the skin grow around it, but that would take too much planning, no one could be bothered to do that!".
Maybe, as you say, they have knowledge of how things work that a normal person isn't aware of, and they can exploit it. Maybe they can remotely hack my iphone and make it do something, that would seem like magic to me.
Maybe Moses parting the Red Sea was just the tide going out? Maybe his visions or talks with god (ala burning bush) were halucinations from eating or smoking something he wasn't used to?
I'm not ruling out the possibility of things like ESP or telekinetic stuff, just like I haven't ruled out aliens, but I'm pretty sure I haven't encountered it yet.
Vinnie, magic isn't a thing, a noun, it's an adjective, basically describing something you don't understand.
I am sure that our aborigines originally thought guns and matches were magic, but it was just advanced technology. It WAS magic to them though. Hell, TV and computers and even landline phones are a deadset miracle if you ask me. How the fark does a remote control for the tv work??
Some people are double jointed, can hold their breath for an extraordinarily long time, or a missing a finger, or have a hole through their chest or tongue from misadventure or choice, it's not magic when they exploit it, it's just messing with your expectations.
Some tricks make use of contraptions and extensive, meticulous planning. In fact a lot of tricks you'd think "the only way they could have done that was to stick that coin into an orange when it was little and then let the skin grow around it, but that would take too much planning, no one could be bothered to do that!".
Maybe, as you say, they have knowledge of how things work that a normal person isn't aware of, and they can exploit it. Maybe they can remotely hack my iphone and make it do something, that would seem like magic to me.
Maybe Moses parting the Red Sea was just the tide going out? Maybe his visions or talks with god (ala burning bush) were halucinations from eating or smoking something he wasn't used to?
I'm not ruling out the possibility of things like ESP or telekinetic stuff, just like I haven't ruled out aliens, but I'm pretty sure I haven't encountered it yet.
Brilliant post. Much appreciated!
We poor, confused little walking pieces of clay find it very hard to convey our meaning sometimes. I know that if I use the words magic or supernatural it can be very, very misleading. I might have an understanding of those words which is totally different to the understanding that someone else has. It may be that "magic" or "supernatural" is something that is actually natural but which we don't understand yet.
I think what I'm trying to get at with this thread is that I'm leaving myself open to the possibility that an elite number of these "magicians" might - might - have knowledge of how to do things which appear supernatural because the rest of us do not yet have the knowledge!
I think a good example of magic is Volition/will.
Where does that come from? Im choosing to do X. And then X happens. so many mystery's right in front of us.
Conscience/Sentience isn't magic, it's neuroscience.
It would be like saying space is magic, just because we don't fully understand it's workings doesn't mean it just happens.
That Jesus guy did alright.
I think a good example of magic is Volition/will.
Where does that come from? Im choosing to do X. And then X happens. so many mystery's right in front of us.
Conscience/Sentience isn't magic, it's neuroscience.
It would be like saying space is magic, just because we don't fully understand it's workings doesn't mean it just happens.
If we describe "magic" as "that which is not understood by most of the population", then there's a hell of a lot of magic happening and that slice of the population is growing & growing & growing...
Biology is magic.
Technology is magic.
Space - magic.
Evolution? DEFINITELY MAGIC.
Magnets.. how do they work?
http://youtu.be/_-agl0pOQfs
I think a good example of magic is Volition/will.
Where does that come from? Im choosing to do X. And then X happens. so many mystery's right in front of us.
Conscience/Sentience isn't magic, it's neuroscience.
It would be like saying space is magic, just because we don't fully understand it's workings doesn't mean it just happens.
In your materialist and reductionist opinion, Neuroscience does not explain intentionality, subjectivity or what conciseness actually is.
And i said "like" magic, meaning if there was anything in this world i would describe as close to magic as i can see, it would be volition.
To say,... im going to raise my arm, and then raise my arm, it is like magic as magic is described, (im going to pull a rabbit from my hat, i pull a rabbit from my hat) where does the raising of my arm come from? biological process?
We know that a concious raising of the arm is through biological process no doubt, but we do not know that conciousness is from a biological process.
If it is from biological process, then why have it? complex machines do not need conciousness to operate.
I cant see this hard problem of Conciousness ever being solved to be honest.
Good post AJ1!
I wouldn't say that I agree with the last sentence. Maybe it will. Maybe that's what the human race needs to solve more than anything.
I'm going out now but later I will post something relevant about your raising the arm example which I think you will find interesting.