Politics Thread

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Andrew Leigh has always impressed me - very policy focused and has an excellent grasp of his portfolio, even if I don't necessarily agree with him all the time. Not sure what he's like as a speaker though, I've mostly seen his written stuff. A PM needs to be able to deliver a speech.

Would probably be a very good treasurer at some stage though.

Was he the Labor bloke on Q&A on Monday, Shadow Assistant Tresurer or something, because I thought he was extremely poor on Q&A, everything he said sounded like it was a heavily focus grouped, sound bite. There was just something about his presentation that was really off putting, it felt like he was trying to take me for a ride whenever he opened his mouth.

He is an academic. He always sounds to me like his is doing a lecture to first year undergrads.

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Andrew Leigh has always impressed me - very policy focused and has an excellent grasp of his portfolio, even if I don't necessarily agree with him all the time. Not sure what he's like as a speaker though, I've mostly seen his written stuff. A PM needs to be able to deliver a speech.

Would probably be a very good treasurer at some stage though.

Was he the Labor bloke on Q&A on Monday, Shadow Assistant Tresurer or something, because I thought he was extremely poor on Q&A, everything he said sounded like it was a heavily focus grouped, sound bite. There was just something about his presentation that was really off putting, it felt like he was trying to take me for a ride whenever he opened his mouth.

He is an academic. He always sounds to me like his is doing a lecture to first year undergrads.


Well suited on QANDA then.

Why should families pay for tax dodgers?

Bill Shorten
The Daily Telegraph
March 05, 2015 12:00AM

WHEN someone told me a few weeks ago James Hardie didn’t pay one dollar of company tax in Australia last year, I got pretty annoyed.

When I found out that James Hardie made annual Australian profits of more than $200 million, and its CEO pockets $12 million every year, I was gobsmacked.

But when I saw it reported that James Hardie is minimising the tax it pays in Australia through a complex set of tax havens in countries such as Bermuda, which give them an average effective tax rate of zero, I was livid.

How is this acceptable — ­legally or morally? How is this fair? Why do Australians who go to work every day stump up their fair share of tax while multinationals can find loopholes to minimise theirs?

While James Hardie is an extreme example, there’s no doubt there are a number of large companies that dodge paying their fair share of tax.

Why should Australians work hard and pay tax if big multinationals get to play by different rules?

Why should local businesses face paying more tax than big multinationals because Australian businesses can’t ­afford high-priced lawyers or an office in the Bahamas?

Australians are rightly becoming increasingly concerned that some large companies are shirking their obligations by putting in place complex schemes to dodge paying their fair share of tax.

We need a level playing field so the heavy lifting isn’t done by Australian businesses and families.

Consider this: in 2012-13 companies moved more than $300 billion between their Australian arms and overseas ­parent or subsidiary companies.

The bottom line is our tax system should not get softer the higher it goes — and how much tax you pay shouldn’t be decided by how good a lawyer you have.

This week, I announced Labor’s plan to help shut down loopholes that allow big multinationals to send their profits into overseas tax havens to avoid paying tax in Australia.

Our plan is designed to ensure a fairer deal by ensuring the competitiveness of Australian businesses is not undermined by an unfair tax system. The plan includes measures that will stop big multinationals from double-dipping on tax exemptions and deductions across different countries.

We also want to strengthen the powers of the Australian Taxation Office so there’s a more ­effective cop on the beat.

Labor is passionately pro-business, but multinational companies have to make their fair contribution, just like the rest of us.

Our plan will shift the tax burden away from Australian families and small business — because for every dollar missed from these multinationals means another dollar families and small business have to pay.

Our plan will mean multinational companies will end paying about $2 billion extra tax in Australia — more than twice as much as the Liberals’ GP Tax is due to raise.

If Joe Hockey and Tony ­Abbott want to legislate these ideas I’m keen to make that happen. But already the ­Liberals are looking for every excuse in the book not to ­tackle this problem.

It’s time for Mr Abbott and Mr Hockey to start doing some lifting instead of leaning.

Bill Shorten is federal Opposition Leader

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Ok, it's getting to the point that everyone is laughing at us now. And seeing it through their eyes I just have to revisit the feeling I had when I realised he was actually going to be given the most important job in the country. Anyway, enjoy. It is very funny but it's pretty awkward too :S

Very loud guffaws.

Sounds good to me, re multinationals tax crackdown.

Yes. Obvious & irrefutable. Now watch someone here “refute” it.

I would add as long as it doesnt move jobs offshore and/or end activity here. But thats happening anyway. I dont pretend to understand the economic workings. But if its a nett gain, do it.

I doubt there’s any Apple or Google jobs that could shift, there wouldn’t be many to begin with.

Almost 200 refugees on Nauru arrested as police crack down on peaceful protests
Ben Doherty

Almost 200 refugees, including several children, have been arrested on Nauru for protesting in the island’s capital, as video has emerged showing refugees being assaulted as they protested peacefully at the weekend.

The majority of refugees were arrested for walking towards the Nauruan police station in Yaren, to protest the arrest of eight others earlier in the day.

Nauru justice minister David Adeang, in confirming 183 were in custody at the island’s jail on Thursday, accused Australian refugee advocates of supporting public disorder and coaching refugees to use social media.
“Police in Nauru took action and arrested them in the same way police in Sydney would if this happened in Pitt Street,” he said in a statement.

At least 40 men are being held in the police cells at Yaren, others are being held in other locations. It is unknown if, and when, they will face a court.

The initial eight were arrested as they walked from the refugee compound to the shops on Wednesday morning.

They were arrested reportedly because they were believed to have been ringleaders in earlier protests over the weekend. One of that group is understood to be 13 years old.

Nauru’s police chief had warned refugees they would be jailed if they gathered publicly in groups larger than three.

The director of Nauru police, Corey Caleb, distributed a four-page document to refugees on Tuesday that said while he respected their “right to expression”, they must desist with public demonstrations.

Asylum seekers inside the detention centre have engaged in a campaign of peaceful non-co-operation, refusing to attend classes or speak with case managers.

Refugees on Nauru live in the community. They are restricted by government decree in where they can go: they cannot visit schools, the hospital, the harbour or airport, but are, usually, free to move about the small island.

A group of refugees staged a series of public demonstrations over the weekend, protesting their resettlement and living conditions on the island.

Video from the island at the weekend shows police clashing with demonstrators, including women and children, and it shows one man attacking a refugee as he peaceably filmed the demonstration.

The video, shot on mobile phone, shows a group of demonstrators walking slowly towards a police line on a road.

The group is noisy, chanting “justice”, but peaceful. Several protesters have their hands crossed above their heads and some are kneeling.

A policeman holds up his hand to stop the protesters.

As the protesters come close to the police, scuffles break out between police and some demonstrators, including one woman wearing a chador.

One refugee close to the camera is filming the demonstration on his mobile phone.

A Nauruan man, not wearing any uniform, steps from behind the police line to punch the refugee in the face while he is not looking.

The refugee staggers, and drops his phone, but picks it back up and resumes filming. He does not retaliate.

The assailant retreats behind the line of police officers.

The Nauru government has said protesters threw stones at police, injuring three and damaging a car.

Nauruan president Baron Waqa said in a statement: “There has been no violence against refugees from police, but police will continue to enforce the law, which includes preventing mobile protests that endanger lives”.

The emergence of the video comes as refugees and asylum seekers were given a four-page document from Corey Caleb, the director of police of Nauru.

Calls to Caleb from Guardian Australia were not returned.

President Waqa has said “faceless people” in Australia were inciting resistance on Nauru.

“Refugees [are] safe in the country and talk to the contrary is blatant lies spread by Australian advocates and lawyers,” he said in a statement.

“We believe they are being directed by faceless people in Australia.”

The Australian immigration department has said the protests are a matter for Nauruan authorities.

Immigration minister Peter Dutton said refugee protests would not influence the government’s commitment to its regional resettlement policy.

“If people who have been resettled on Nauru believe that these activities will change Australia’s position – they are wrong … those who come illegally by boat will never be settled in Australia.”

He said refugees should treat the people and government of Nauru with “gratitude and respect”.

“I believe Nauru’s authorities have acted with restraint in the face of some days of these provocative actions and understandably Nauru’s police will deal with any breacheionion.s of Nauruan law. If people breach the law then they should expect to face the consequences of their actions.”

Ian Rintoul from the Refugee Action Coalition said Nauru’s collaboration with the Australian government on asylum seekers had damaged its human rights record and heavy-handed policing to stifle protests would further harm its international reputation.

“As more and more refugees are released into the community on Nauru, the political and social problems for the Nauruan government will grow,” Rintoul said. “The refugees being warehoused for the Australian government are being denied resettlement and are essentially confined to Nauru against their will, as a permanently deprived underclass, with no future.”

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/mar/04/up-to-70-refugees-nauru-arrested-police-crack-down-peaceful-protests

Australian authorities continue with their Pontius Pilate impersonation.

Like the kid says, it’s not fair.

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I would add as long as it doesnt move jobs offshore and/or end activity here. But thats happening anyway. I dont pretend to understand the economic workings. But if its a nett gain, do it.

Seems to be a simple solution.

If their foreign (read tax haven) wants to lend their Australian arm money at rates way above the current rates, then don’t allow it as a tax deduction. Only allow the current bank rate (2.25%).

Intercompany loans should not be deductible. That seems to be the way they reduce their taxable income here.

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I would add as long as it doesnt move jobs offshore and/or end activity here. But thats happening anyway. I dont pretend to understand the economic workings. But if its a nett gain, do it.

Seems to be a simple solution.

If their foreign (read tax haven) wants to lend their Australian arm money at rates way above the current rates, then don’t allow it as a tax deduction. Only allow the current bank rate (2.25%).

Intercompany loans should not be deductible. That seems to be the way they reduce their taxable income here.

They do that or use one of their companies in tax havens to charge a licensing fee for doing business in country X.

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I would add as long as it doesnt move jobs offshore and/or end activity here. But thats happening anyway. I dont pretend to understand the economic workings. But if its a nett gain, do it.

Seems to be a simple solution.

If their foreign (read tax haven) wants to lend their Australian arm money at rates way above the current rates, then don’t allow it as a tax deduction. Only allow the current bank rate (2.25%).

Intercompany loans should not be deductible. That seems to be the way they reduce their taxable income here.

They do that or use one of their companies in tax havens to charge a licensing fee for doing business in country X.

Whatever…should be banned as a tax deduction.

There is also cases though where offshore workers do stuff for local purposes.

For example, I worked on a big data migration to an SAP system for a large manufacturer here (yes, they are still open too btw!). Onshore was the experts in the legacy system. Back in Italy there was a suite of BA’s, dev’s, PM’s, etc that were experts in SAP as well as the global strategy. Now, the work they were doing was specific to the local Australian business but using the Europe based workers was ideal as they were across the global project. The Australian arm was paying for them at consulting rates.

This is legit, and at the risk of sounding like DT, although I think we all agree, we do need to understand that not all “profit” going overseas is dodgy.

James Hardie are ****s. The executives that dragged the compo cases through the courts until most the victims died should be the ones facing the firing squads

Here is an invite received today from CSIRO, encouraging me to “freelance” work overseas. I find this very disturbing.

"…
Great Ideas & Guts Tour presents Labour without Borders
The rise of freelancing in the on-demand economy

A website built for $10 per hour by Maraz, living in Dhaka, Bangladesh. An app built for $200 by Shahzaib from his home in Karachi, Pakistan.

The internet is globalising labour. McKinseys estimate 160 million jobs, or about 11% of the projected 1.46 billion services jobs worldwide can be completed remotely.

Australian entrepreneurs and SMEs can access this global talent pool via online marketplaces that link freelancers with companies seeking an array of skills - legal, design, accounting, engineering, software development, architecture, product sourcing, writing etc.

These marketplaces are evolving rapidly, allowing entrepreneurs and SMEs to outsource a growing range of their functions to low cost countries. A single market for labour may mean that companies retain fewer staff.

Freelancer is a growing Australian company that is connecting entrepreneurs and SMEs with a global supply of workers. Its founder and CEO, Matt Barrie will address how accessing international freelancers can benefit Australian SMEs.

Business models are changing, and if you would like to understand how a globalising workforce could impact your enterprise, please join us for what we expect to be a stimulating event.

Date:

Tuesday 31 March 2015
Time:
9:30am for registration
Commence at 10:00am and finish
no later than 11:15am
Location:
Australian Synchrotron,
800 Blackburn Road, Clayton, Melbourne
Between Ferntree Gully & Wellington Roads. Plenty of on site parking.
RSVP before:
Tuesday 17 March 2015

The Presenter: Matt Barrie
Matt Barrie is an award winning entrepreneur, technologist and lecturer, having won numerous awards including being named the inaugural BRW Entrepreneur of the Year in 2011.

Matt was previously founder and CEO of Sensory Networks Inc., a vendor of high performance network security processors, which Intel Corporation (NASDAQ: INTC) acquired. Matt is also an Adjunct Associate Professor at the Department of Electrical and Information Engineering at the University of Sydney, where for the last 12 years he has taught Cryptography, and from 2010, Technology Entrepreneurship. He is the co-author of over 20 US patent applications. In 2011, SmartCompany named him in the 11 most influential Australians in IT.

The fundamental problem is that it’s like playing whack-a-mole. There’s a huge financial incentive for companies to profit-shift - more than enough incentive for them to hire a bunch of expensive lawyers & accountants to work out a weaselly but on-paper legal way to do it, and the sheer complexity of tax and company law makes it inevitable that there’ll always be loopholes that can be exploited by said expensive lawyers and accountants.

Not to say we shouldn’t try, but this sort of thing is the downside of globalisation and the international market. It’ll be a constant battle, not something that is just solved at a stroke with one set of reforms.

Interesting policy and unquestionably morally right. I imagine there will be a couple of influential lobby groups throwing some threats at Labor over this. Now, if they can release some policy about getting the nation’s science institutions back in order (and reinstate an actual minister for science) then I really will start listening. Also, get carbon trading back on deck and a renewables strategy in place and they will have my vote for the first time in a very, very long time.

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There is also cases though where offshore workers do stuff for local purposes.

For example, I worked on a big data migration to an SAP system for a large manufacturer here (yes, they are still open too btw!). Onshore was the experts in the legacy system. Back in Italy there was a suite of BA’s, dev’s, PM’s, etc that were experts in SAP as well as the global strategy. Now, the work they were doing was specific to the local Australian business but using the Europe based workers was ideal as they were across the global project. The Australian arm was paying for them at consulting rates.

This is legit, and at the risk of sounding like DT, although I think we all agree, we do need to understand that not all “profit” going overseas is dodgy.

James Hardie are ****s. The executives that dragged the compo cases through the courts until most the victims died should be the ones facing the firing squads

If you can demonstrate the commercials - fine, but a lot of of transfer pricing is wrong.

What would any of you know about this stuff? Huh? Unless you’re an expert in taxation law then you shouldn’t be commenting on this. Shut up, all of you, at once.

I’m looking at you, Shorten.

Also Noonan. Who do you think you are, mate? Some kind of professional in the field of financial transactions?

ding tripper?

9 yo kid nails it.